Which kernel are you using?
From uname -a: Linux tau-volantis 6.14.0-29-generic #29~24.04.1-Ubuntu SMP PREEMPT_DYNAMIC Thu Aug 14 16:52:50 UTC 2 x86_64 x86_64 x86_64 GNU/Linux
Which BIOS version are you using?
03.05
Which Framework Laptop 16 model are you using?
Laptop 16 (AMD Ryzen 7040 Series)
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I am aware that there is some firmware-level performance configuration that says when the device is connected to max the CPU performance. However, this makes the fans always on, and also doesn’t properly cool the system, leading for it to be actually warm to the touch.
This is a problem, because I’d rather let the OS control the performance cap/throttle with Balanced instead of Performance level settings.
Is there a mechanism to override this in the Framework BIOS or such so that the CPU and fans aren’t always maxed on AC power? It also makes the laptop ‘noisy’ when using AC power, which is an annoyance and a problem.
I don’t know why you would want to do this instead of just using the balanced or power-saver profile, but you could disable the power-profiles-daemon (which is what provides the power-saver, balanced, and performance profiles) and use something like auto-cpufreq to control it instead, however that would just be modifying the frequency instead of the other hidden options as well.
There’s a little more information here:
I would recommend against this, as my own testing as well as the resident AMD Driver engineer on the forums, suggest that PPD is the more power efficient and performant option on the table.
Note that you can’t use PPD and auto-cpufreq together, they would compete with an undo one another unpredictable (or so I’m told).
I have the Power Saving profile set on the system, but the AC power connectivity immediately sets and overrides this and ignores PPD’s settings. Which suggests there’s something at the system firmware level that’s ignoring the PPD settings. In Ubuntu, these’re set by a handy little widget that lets me set the power profile, but this profile setting is always ignored on AC power, setting CPU scaling to max (100%) and always running hot with fans and such maxed as a result.
Oooh, that’s quite interesting. Assuming it’s not simply heat from the battery charging (mine definitely get’s hot to the touch while charging with 0 cpu load), then yeah you’re definitely looking at EC AC vs Bat controller differences. I recall there being hard-coded differences between the two, but I don’t remember many of the details. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable will chime in.
For whatever it’s worth, I don’t recall my power-save resulting in fan’s-on.
If it is battery heat, then the system isn’t cutting to just AC power after the battery is at 100%. When not at load (and I check by htop), just idling, this behavior happens. Even when nothing is running. So I know it’s beyond just “system power” settings and “battery heat”. True, the battery gets warm/hot when it charges but even at 100% charge it still is warm to the touch at the keyboard which is not where the battery is inside the system (it’s effectively underneath the mouse / touchpad panels not the keyboard), though the CPU (and onboard CPU-integrated Radeon graphics) is under the keyboard area.
Which is why I’m hunting this down further. Especially since this has been ongoing long enough that I think one of the fan’s bearings is starting to wear out…
Hmm, yeah that definitely doesn’t sound like battery heat then, which should be undetectable at 100% charge. If it’s getting warm to the touch under no load, then physically it sounds like the clock is high and the fan speed is low (assuming the calculation workload is low). If the fans are high and the workload is low, then the temperatures should be low.
Have you looked at your CPU temps? If you’re unit is old enough to have liquid metal, then chances are you’re experiencing the thermal degradation and should request a PTM replacement kit (which makes a drastic difference). My kit resulted in a 20-30c drop on cpu temps.
On my FW16, it definitely does not change the CPU scaling or force the CPUs to max speed when AC power is connected. Maybe your firmware is older/different, but I would agree with TechPriestNhyk’s advice to check the temperature and consider fixing your cooling… it could also be some malfunction in the battery or something.
You can check with btop, too, and see what speed the CPU is actually running at at any given moment. Generally when the system isn’t loaded it should be low even when the machine is plugged in.
Also, has it always done this since you got it? Or did it just start having this fans-always-on-when-plugged-in behavior recently?
Running 03.05 currently for the framework, it seems 03.05 BIOS/firmware started doing this though I don’t see how since that was just an update for the SecureBoot keyrings.
It’s been doing this since the 03.05 updates, the previous firmware didn’t seem to be doing this. I’ll check btop and see if I can see anything unusual there.
I purchased this FW16 back in February of this year, I don’t know if it’s old enough to have liquid metal, even if it came with liquid metal I would’ve swapped that with PTM 7958 or an alternative during setup, I have a hatred for “liquid metal” cooling stuff.
I am pretty sure I have 03.05 as well, and I definitely don’t see this issue… I remember some kind of rumors of the early FW16s running super hot all the time, but I have not seen it or heard about it for a while. IDK what the reason is behind why yours suddenly started doing it.
Most likely not. The FW16s shipped with LM were pre-orders. The manufacturing process switched to PTM7958 during the last few pre-order batches, if memory serves.
This looks like it was a two-fold problem. First, I discovered that there was a rogue process running on the machine. Looks like there was something running in my ‘sandbox vm’ that has no network access that was trying to do a nasty. Oops! Found and nuked that.
Second, looks like my computer was trying to run a few containers that are on here as ‘backup copies’ which in turn resulted in the system always turning them on. Well THAT’S not good, right? Shut those off and the system started to behave as expected.
RIP me, sorry for bugging you all on this. Guess 03.04 or something else made the fan curves a bit more hypersensitive though than before.
For some background, the EC controls the power settings. It varies depending on psu power brick size and whether plugged in or not and which of the 3 profiles the user selects.
