Request: Review of Framework Laptop 16 Keyboard Layouts

[Ivan_Jelenic]

Slovenian layout (which is also the Croatian layout) looks good.

[Florian_Beck]

Not exactly a factual error, but to me it’s not clear what the framework logo on the F12 key does?

[Schuasda]

The key is explained further up in this thread:

Request: Review of Framework Laptop 16 Keyboard Layouts

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the F12 / Gear symbol key. Keys like this are extra keys / special keys (aka hotkeys or multimedia keys), and there is no standard or even typical set of keys that are included on keyboards, nor standard placement for them. Many of them, like the gear / settings key, have no standard function either. The user decides what they want it to do. For some keys, Windows (or other OS) might give the hotkey some default action, just to avoid it doing nothing by…

[Techie_Zeddie]

@Request: Review of Framework Laptop 16 Keyboard Layouts

There seems to be a lot of confusion about the F12 / Gear symbol key. Keys like this are extra keys / special keys (aka hotkeys or multimedia keys), and there is no standard or even typical set of keys that are included on keyboards, nor standard placement for them. Many of them, like the gear / settings key, have no standard function either. The user decides what they want it to do. For some keys, Windows (or other OS) might give the hotkey some default action, just to avoid it doing nothing by…

I think that brings up the OS’s settings, but I’m not entirely sure.

Windows has moved from their Control Panel to a Settings page. Gnome’s the same too (both are very similar to mobile OSes). I’m not familiar with other DEs to know if they have a single Settings panel this will open, too.

[MJ1]

@Florian_Beck

Not exactly a factual error, but to me it’s not clear what the framework logo on the F12 key does?

It sends the “Media Select” keycode. Windows assigns this an action of launching the default media player, same on Linux.

But you can change that default action and program the key to do whatever you want.

F12 / Framework key

It sends a keycode known as “Media Select” from the extended multimedia key set (0xE0, 0x50). Typically, that means it will launch a media player. You can bind it to do whatever you please. If you’re using xbindkeys, for example, you would call it XF86AudioMedia. Various window managers and desktop environments offer different functionality for keyboard binding.

[StarrWulfe]

Japanese
Request: Review of Framework Laptop 16 Keyboard Layouts - #12 by Matt_Hartley

Is it possible at this late stage to also include the Macbook variant layout for those of us coming from that platform as well, or is this too much of an edge case to consider? the main difference is the way it treats the “Henkan” functions of switching between Japanese characters, Chinese characters (Kanji) and Latin/Roman characters, all of which are inherent and necessary when composing the typical Japanese document.

Basically after using a Mac for so many years, my muscle memory has made it much quicker to switch on the Macbook layout because the buttons to the left and right of the Spacebar are labeled “Latin” and “Kana (Japanese)” respectively so it’s easier than the typical method of using the one key to the left of the “1” key that does the same thing in the normal Japanese layout. Those keys next to the space key in this case are muhenkan; don’t change to Kanji, and henkan – change to Kanji. This is used when already in kana mode typing in Japanese characters and needing to make (or not make) them in to Kanji. To the right of that you have the katakana/hirangana/romaji (latin characters) switching key.

These methods are holdovers from legacy Japanese input method editors from back when electronic word processors were being normalized in the 1970s and '80s. Incidentally, the Japanese characters on the keyboard layout itself is a holdover from Japanese typewriters and I have never seen someone use them directly outside of those working in train stations and certain government fields where they have special machines that use this layout to do data entry functions; no one in Japan really learns that method of typing nowadays and the norm is to use Roman/Latin letters to “sound out” the Japanese characters and software IMEs will automatically make the right characters appear.

In Apple fashion, they simplified this and made it necessary to need only the two extra buttons on the keyboard next to the Spacebar.

if possible, please consider adding this layout variant to the lineup.

[Azure]

@StarrWulfe

or is this too much of an edge case to consider?

If all you want is to switch the key next to the 1 with one of the keys to either side of the spacebar, you can take advantage of the fact that it has support for qmk to change that in software.

[MJ1]

@StarrWulfe

Those keys next to the space key in this case are muhenkan; don’t change to Kanji, and henkan – change to Kanji.

I search a bit about those keys regarding qmk. Seems they are known as KC_MHEN and KC_HENK.
Yea, I think there wouldn’t be a problem using them. As Azure said, you should be able to remap the keys to either side of the spacebar to them. And also change the key next to “1”. You can move / rearrange keys any which way you want in qmk.

[fw16]

I agree with @StarrWulfe. If that is too much to ask, then maybe an “Linux variant” where instead of a Windows key there is a super key. I am also coming from a Mac Japanese keyboard layout, but I am fine with the current proposed layout. I will definitely use Linux on my Framework 16, so having a super key would be ideal.

[Jesus_Leganes-Combar]

I would love to have spanish layout with symbols for ALL the combinations of shift and alt, similar to the pan-eu layouts, so we can have visible all the glyphs. A map like this can be drawn with xkeyinfo tool.

[Tor-Erik_Klausen]

@Matt_Hartley

The Norwegian layout looks good except for the extra “,” on the M-key

[Bill_Moroney]

Does anyone else need a US keyboard layout but with the CapsLock and Ctrl keys swapped? I can find mechanical keyboards with this “old fashioned” pre-PS/2 layout but I’d love to have a laptop with the “correct” layout having the Ctrl key left of the A.

[MJ1]

Welcome to the forum.

@Bill_Moroney

Does anyone else need a US keyboard layout but with the CapsLock and Ctrl keys swapped?

You’ll be able to easily swap them with QMK, which the Framework-16 input modules all come with. And use decals if you need the labels switched too.

[xaen]

Is there any dxf/dwg/anything with units of the keycaps/keyboards released yet? I’d like to make some clear keystickers for the ansi rgb and the rgb macropad.

[sharpjs]

@Bill_Moroney

Does anyone else need a US keyboard layout but with the CapsLock and Ctrl keys swapped?

I configure the Caps Lock position to be LCtrl.

It’s not a swap though. My bottom row modifiers are different too:

LWin LAlt RCtrl Space Compose Menu Fn RWin

[Gabor_Arki]

I might be late, but Hungarian layout looks okay, although it does contain a couple of alternate characters that don’t tend to be printed on the keys.

Ä (AltGr E) and ä (AltGr A) are not part of the Hungarian alphabet and are not typically printed on the keys.

Í (AltGr I) and í (AltGr J) have a primary key already, left to the Y key. So, these again are not printed on the I and J keys.

< (AltGr M) and > (AltGr : ) are duplicates, the primary location for these characters is at the Í and Y keys on the left. So, again, these are not typically printed on the M and : keys.

Otherwise, it looks good to me. Hope to see a Hungarian layout for the 13", that may be the last thing holding me back from the purchase.

[theoamonteiro]

@Matt_Hartley

Portuguese
(UPDATED)

While was pointed on another topic that are 250M of Portuguese native speakers, most of them are in Brazil. In Brazil there is another standard, usually called ABNT2 (see image bellow). I suppose the offering of Spanish Latin America layout - Framework | Framework Keyboard - is compound by the Spanish Latinx speakers in USA, not only those on Spain market. Even so I would like to suggest to put in consideration a Portuguese Brazilian layout when starting the sales in Portugal. The layout is, unfortunately, almost ISO, there are 4 keys between “M” and the right Shift (instead of 3 in the ISO). The main issue with the Portuguese European/ISO layout, and any layout that makes the access to “[”, “]”, “{”, “}” through Alt Gr, is that it is a programmer’s hell and nightmare. Please put a layout more “programmer-friendly”:

[Klay_Hart]

I don’t know if it’s been said but a RGB numpad would be nice to match the RGB keyboard. Might look a bit odd with RGB keyboard and just white numpad.

[Matt_Hartley]

Czech/Slovak keyboard layout updated, seeking feedback please.