I generally don’t buy consumer grade hardware, and really don’t consider the Framework consumer grade. Guess we should all lower out expectations, or desires, however seeing as how this is their only product and taking into consideration their stated goals they are going to have to move in that direction eventually.
Guess I was spoiled with Thinkpads.
I dont see what people are complaining about. My experience of laptop manufacturers is they MIGHT release ONE bios update for any given model if and only if there is a serious problem with the shipped version, and they MIGHT release another to further restrict consumer choice if they find out that consumers are doing things to bypass restrictions in the original version. (Hello HP, retroactively encrypting your bioses to stop people defeating your anti-consumer hardware whitelists)
Other than that, you can get stuffed, especially if it’s more than a year old, because they aren’t interested in it anymore.
I agree that FW has been slow to provide updates and feedback. What I disagree with is drawing conclusions about the health of the company or about FW’s commitment to long-term support.
Now this I appreciate. Thank you.
Yeah but then that one actually works, because if it doesn’t they have to take it back and refund the whole thing, and that blows away the profit from 10 other laptops.
I would prefer if there were zero updates, because the factory bios was actually finished before shipping.
Disclaimer: I solved the problem, just posting to save other people time and reporting a bug.
I had a problem upgrading over lfvs. When updating, it said, PD1 Update failed, while PD2 was successful. In the BIOS PD Controller 1 Ver was 0.1.14, while PD Controller 2 Ver was 0.1.21. Back in the system fwupdmgr downloaded the updated again, so I wanted to reboot and update gain, but I was not able to really start it. Fwupdmgr.efi was booted, found the update, rebooted the system twice to a black screen, then it booted back into my system.
I tried a lot of things in different combinations: Changing the charger from the left to the right (all 4 ports multiple times), tried USB-A charger method, tried changing DisableCapsuleUpdateOnDisk=false, since I thought probably the new 3.06 BIOS does not need it set to true anymore, but always the same behavior.
In the end I tried the UEFI Shell update method, which worked fine.
Ideal situation indeed.
But nothing is finished with unforseen bugs and feature additions you only come up with by actual infield usage. I also dislike microcode updates, why do Intel not just make a cpu and its perfect? /s
Can we get weekly status reports on the progress here?
I think the point being made by Brian was about the comparison to other manufactures and that they would rather one fully functional BIOS than getting any updates at all which right or wrong is their perception of other manufactures BIOS and desire.
Good point non the less everything created by humans is flawed in some way and at least they are doing the right thing by trying to fixing the problems.
Hi, I have installed a fresh Windows 11 Enterprise 22H2, and installed the BIOS 3.06 beta update. I do not have drivers for many of the laptop devices (e.g. touchpad gestures don’t function, no right-click etc). Is there a driver back I can install without worrying about accidentally downgrading the bios version?
Framework Laptop BIOS and Driver Releases (12th Gen Intel® Core™) this maybe? I hope modern drivers wont just downgrade the bios (meaning, you probably have to explicitly tell a update tool to “downgrade” firmware) but im a linux user, no windows experience on the FW
@CodeAsm @jamieg The driver bundle is independent of the BIOS update. Please proceed with installing the driver bundle.
@GhostLegion On a fresh Windows 11 Enterprise build the driver bundle decompresses, and a cmd window opens up for <1sec and then closes, no output is seen. Any ideas what this might be?
@jamieg Not really as I use Linux. Doesn’t sound like it worked given what I’m reading here. Supposedly the process should take several minutes and you would be prompted to reboot. Are you certain you have the right driver bundle? This is for 11th Gen and this is for 12th gen.
Re-reading the instructions in the linked article…it sounds dead simple. Download driver bundle, run .exe or whatever and reboot. I really don’t see where it could be messing up. Try re-downloading the bundle and re-running the update?
Now im curious. one could decompress the bundle manually and check the install scripts. determine which step opens a shell and what it tries to do. might be a version check, a permission error. Enterprise might influence it but doubt it.
If you stay curious, you might end up installing linux and checking every sourcefile like some of us 
but probably harmless if the driver pack came from framework itself
EDIT: opened the installer, seems like a CMD window indeed, it mentions installing drivers. (and now my wine install got a few drivers)
The point was not that I expect things to be perfect. The point was responding to a comment that implied everyone just wants updates because updates are good and we’re lucky we even get any updates because some manufacturers don’t provide any updates… which all starts to get away from what actually matters. Updates (in something like a firmware) are only good if there is some problem or missing feature that needs an update to fix it.
The presumption was too simple that more updates == better.
With our buggy bios we definitely do need an update, but in fact the even better, very best possibility would be to never get even one single update, because the bios was fully tested and functional before shipping. Sure that’s unlikely, but that doesn’t change the fact that that would actually be the best and most ideal. And some of those other manufacturers with no updates do manage it sometimes, so it is not a pointless theoretical to mention as thought it’s not possible.
Of course perfection isn’t reasonable (although, something like a firmware with a limited and well-defined set of functions IS perfectly able to be fully tested and exercised, so saying “perfection” isn’t actually so outlandish unreasonable). But the same applies to merely fewer updates vs zero. If we can’t have perfect zero, then the same point still stands that fewer is still better than more, IF it’s because few are needed.
I don’t just want a stream of updates because I just love applying firmware updates and the more the better. I bought a computer to use it for other things. I want my battery to last as long as it’s supposed to and I want all my usb ports to work properly and I don’t want the machine to lock up when I try to access the boot select menu and I don’t want to follow the manufacturer supplied directions for a procedure and wind up in a boot loop with no directions how to recover, etc. The money I paid doesn’t have any annoying misbhaving functions. It’s fully functional.
Just did another Windows 11 Enterprise install and it worked OK, but this time I didn’t update it first (kept it off the internet for the entire duration), I don’t know if this is a red herring but at least it’s working now.
Those manufacturers simply don’t update for security vulnerabilities exposed after launch. This is why manufacturers like Lenovo tend to provide BIOS updates for up to ten years on their business lines. I have Thinkpad T430 that was still receiving updates last year. I want those updates, I don’t want a progressively more vulnerable computer.
I feel like your using lots of words to only describe a perfect world that will never exist.
I stepped away from windows, because they FORCE those updates on you. needless extra software, useless layouts, or styles and wanna see dollars when I want to use a word processor with a spell and grammar check (I often need to check mine).
Have you ever looked at the amount of bugs in bioses? and that they fix? The current bios works fine for most folks (including me). and its nice when they find bugs, fix em and give a update. perfect will never excist. even if we want to go back to the good old days with Basic, variants of Basic in various computers had bugs in them, next versions got fixed and some hardware quirks where found. not many back then got an update, or you where going to desolder proms (with eproms) or simly stuck with said bug.
This, I want more secure when more bugs and exploits/vulnerabilities are found. like i said earlier, they may not even be “bugs” within the firmware itself. it may even be a “feature” or “convenience” added later. only after experiencing something, you can maybe describe what you want/need.
My true wish, Coreboot. we give you a very locked down, highly tested basic variant and you dont need updates. (beside maybe security ones)
EDIT: I see you really wish for coreboot in that other thread. but also seeing 2 flagged post (replies). I dint do that. maybe tone? we might go arround in circles here. Its Intel that probably forces Framework to enable BootGuard on retail units.