Framework Laptop 16 User Reviews

Moon Dancer OS, what will they think of next…

Just finished setting up and upgrading my new laptop. First impressions are mixed. As others have noted the trackpad module is raised on one side rather dramatically and is quite annoying to brush when using the arrow keys. This bowing of components also affects my structural under plate. In my opinion the mounting point for the trackpad and bottom spacers is too low on the pieces to properly tame the sharp corners. The sixteen screws, is well ridiculous coming from the 13 inch model and the lack of actual rigidity it provides to things like the keyboard. Despite using the same keyboard from the 13 inch models certain keys like the function key for my OS don’t work on this model and work just fine on the original. I’m not sure if this trackpad is the same as well (although clearly smaller which is again baffling considering how much this computer costs) but likewise there was additional configuration needed to get the firmware to recognize certain gestures and buttons and am still working through this. By far my largest gripe is the e-waste mediatek wifi card that we are being forced to purchase. I had to switch out to my old Intel ax210 from my 13 inch which has vastly superior support in the OS’s I use and buy a new one for my 13 inch. Lastly the BIOS for these AMD machines is shockingly lacking in terms of available features in comparison to their Intel counter-parts. It’s still early days for me and many of these issues will be improved or fixed with software updates.

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@byteskeptical I have to admit, that it must be a monday model you gathered.
Everything works out great on mine. Spacers are aligned. I had to be careful on how to place them though (it is a bit tricky to put them in place), but once I understood the logic behind the way they are placed and have to snap, everything is smooth.
For the rest, using Linux and KDE Neon with the HWE kernel, everything worked out of the box. No problem on the track-pad nor the keyboard. Even the mediatek WiFi card shows no issues. Connected to my Mikrotik it shows 300Mbps on 2.4Ghz and 600Mbps on 5Ghz. Most issues are due to compatibility with bad AP’s. But it is true that sometimes on mainstream AP’s you don’t get updates of the firmware, so you have to update all clients or buy a new WiFi card on the devices where you can actually replace/change it …

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I’m glad things worked out better out of the box. Question since your running linux does the display port dongle work for you? On an Ubuntu 22 live environment is wasn’t working for me. I’m honestly quite surprised by your lack of issues with the Mediatek card but my opinion on the devices have been biased by previous experience and things may have improved since the last time I gave them a chance. Whatever the performance of the device maybe, support for linux and bsd’s has been not great and currently it isn’t supported on my OS of choice. Would not be a problem but for the fact that Framework doesn’t provide even an option for an alternative when pre-ordering which is just pedantic since one can simply buy from the marketplace or elsewhere on the interwebs.

I actually don’t know what you expect and what Is you use. But in general, using Ubuntu type OS is a rather stable experience (Using only Linux, and that since 1992).
The Display Port dongle works out of the box without a problem. Using it right now. There are screens it will not work with, but that is an issue with the screen’s and/or DP card firmware.
For the mediatek card, I just made sure to use the HWE (Hardware Enablement Kernel) when the hardware is very new. Usually that makes it.

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Well I expect things to work but if they don’t I would want to know why or how I can fix it. I was pretty candid about the OS and version I was trying.

That’s kind of the point of my question though. I don’t doubt that this hardware has better support in certain OS’s over others or with certain hardware over others. Those are the details I’m interested in. As a linux user since 92 surely your aware of the pitfalls of having incompatible hardware and wanting to avoid those incompatibilities if possible or fix the underlying incompatibility.

That’s a good suggestion for compatibility in the kernel but there have been documentated inefficiencies with idle power and throughput documented in several threads [0]. Now things may improve or perhaps have already improved with updates but that’s why threads like this exist to document the current state of things.

[0] - [SOLVED] RZ616 WiFi issues - #12 by Embcla

well, I check hardware/tests etc first, and if that is not available, what hardware is used and how it works on other devices.
I cannot confirm to have since I use it, that I have high idle-power with my RZ616 …
If you give me a way to test it, I’m willing to try.

Got my batch 10 Framework 16 on Monday.

Assembly was dead easy, installed:

As expected the spacers don’t line up super-well on the top surface. What I wasn’t expecting though is the very obvious horizontal ridge between touchpad area & keyboard area across the entire width of the laptop. And the same again between laptop and grill/power button area. In both cases the laptop area is 1-2mm lower than the adjacent areas. Maybe that’s a deliberate design to help keep the components in place but I hadn’t heard anyone mention it before. I don’t notice it in normal use.

Installing Ubuntu was only slightly traumatic - the USB A slots need more of a shove than I’m used to which took me rather longer to realise than it should’ve. And for some reason I had to disable IPv6 before it’d connect to the internet but that may be more to do with my home setup than anything else :man_shrugging:

I ordered without a PSU thinking a phone charger would do the trick. I’ve tried a variety but none work - the charging light comes on for a second or two before going out. I bought a MOMAX universal travel adapter which works but I don’t yet know how quickly… It’s supposed to be able to supply 140W through its PD port, I can’t figure out after a couple of minutes googling how to check the actual charging power I get though. If it charges to full overnight that’ll do.

It’s a big laptop - about the same width as my 10yr old 15" MacBook Pro but slightly thicker & heavier and quite a lot deeper. It’s not as comfortable to use on my lap (which I do a fair bit) as there are what I’m going to call standoffs running across the majority of its width on the base, presumably to improve cooling when using it on a table. They dig in a bit which necessitates moving it around every so often to give my legs a break.

The keyboard is a little softer to my old Mac keyboard but I reckon I’ve got used to it already. And I’ve seen no sign of the flex other reviewers have mentioned. Shame it’s got a Windows key on it but maybe I ticked the wrong box when ordering?

I haven’t put much strain on the laptop yet so I’ve yet to hear the fans and I’ve no real idea of battery life just yet - it looks like I should get somewhere between five and eight hours from a full charge though. That’s fine for my use.

Overall I’m happy - it’s not perfect by any stretch but I’m happy enough to put up with that for the sustainability / upgradability.

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After a few weeks with my batch 6, here are some early impressions.

I got the DIY without GPU, with standard keyboard and num pad, and I added 64GB Crucial 5600 RAM and a 4TB Western Digital Black SN850X SSD.

Summary - good

  • easy set up
  • generally nice build quality (with exceptions)
  • no substantial glitches in 4 weeks of use
  • great screen
  • great sound
  • all the stuff we love about Framework

Summary - bad

  • poor fit and finish around the input deck
  • no num lock indicator
  • fans are loud when gaming
  • hard to get the micro SD card out (although this is not specific to the FL16)
  • screen minimum brightness too high

Setup

  • Building was a breeze
  • Memory training only took about 20 - 30 seconds.

Quality/Feel

  • For its size, it doesn’t seem too heavy, but it’s no featherweight. No complaints from me about that though. I don’t move it around too often and I prefer knowing it’s well built rather than light.
  • The laptop feels solid and well made when closed.
  • I love that it doesn’t seem to attract finger prints.
  • The keyboard flex isn’t really bad, but you can certainly notice it if you apply a bit of pressure in certain areas.
  • Screen flex is pretty substantial if you open the screen from the corner, but just open it from the middle and it’s all good.
  • The alignment issue between the input modules/spacers and the keyboard and chassis are pretty obvious and it’s a shame that they do detract from the impression of quality.
  • The spacers have a different finish from the touchpad module. They are a bit more shiny. This too affects the appearance of quality.
  • In summary when laptop is closed it looks great, but when it’s open, anything longer than a casual glance and you will notice this is a gen 1 product from a finish perspective.
  • I wish the chassis didn’t taper at the front. It would have been gorgeous if it was just a nice rectangular prism.

Keyboard

  • Average. My old Lenovo was a bit better. But I hate all laptop keyboards, so it’s really a moot point. I rarely use it.
  • I do love having the num pad. It’s s big part of why I wanted a 16 inch laptop. The dedicated calculator button is nice touch. The escape key is a surprise.
  • There is no indicator light for num lock, which is disappointing.

Heat

  • Light tasks: warm when on AC, cool when on battery.
  • Watching a video on AC: warm to hot
  • Gaming on AC: hot

Fans

  • Loud (to me) when iGPU is under high load. Playing Clone Drone in the Danger Zone runs the 3D engine at about 100%, sending the GPU temp over 70C. A moment of this and the fans are screaming. For me this was loud enough to ruin the enjoyment of the game without putting on headphones. Fortunately I prefer to use my external monitor for games, and because its native resolution is about half that of the laptop screen, the 3D engine drops to about 60% and the fans die right back to almost nothing.

Screen

  • Great. Again, this is very subjective, but I love the matte display and the resolution is more than enough. I have no issues with the backlight consistency or colours. Mind you, I’m coming from an 11 year old Lenovo Yoga with an objectively awful screen.
  • The minimum brightness isn’t very low at all. If I used the laptop in a dark room, the screen would be far too bright for me. (This is in Windows, I haven’t tried Linux, and I haven’t tried using any tools to force a lower brightness.)

Speakers

  • Great for a laptop.

Expansion ports

  • They fit quite tightly. I have tough fingernails so I can get them out, but it’s not easy.
  • The micro SD card reader is a bit odd. Instead of push-to-release, the card doesn’t go all the way in, so to remove it you just pull it out. But it only protrudes about 3mm so it’s really tricky to get a grip on the card to pull it out.
  • No issues with Type A, type C, or HDMI. Have not had a chance to try the display port or ethernet yet.

Fingerprint reader

  • I’ve had it malfunction once in 4 weeks (refused to detect finger at all when trying to auth with Windows Hello). Pretty good other than that.

Touchpad

  • Feels nice, but I don’t use it much.

Performance

  • I haven’t done any heavy lifting yet, but the laptop starts quickly and run smoothly. I have had no issues.
  • When doing light work, the fans are usually silent.

All in all, I love it and I’m happy with my purchase.

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The MOMAX universal travel adapter is … a bit rubbish. I really doubt it’s putting out 140W as the laptop says the battery is still being drained even when the charger is plugged in. I’ll get more data in time but in the short term I’ve ordered Framework’s 180W charger partly so I know it’s not the laptop and partly because the MOMAX will do in a pinch (like going on holiday) as it will charge the laptop overnight if nothing else is plugged in…

I find the speakers pretty quiet though. I find I need to be up at or near 100% volume a fair bit, my old MacBook Pro I hovered around 60-70%. Disappointed with that tbh.

I wonder if it’s a driver or OS issue? In Windows I find them more than adequate. Like I don’t think I’d ever use 100%. I’m probably not going over about 50% (I’ll have to check that when I’m at home and update this if I’m way off).

I have 2 HP X360 laptops. Both are somewhat weak on volume, which may partly be due to age…
Anyway, I am running Linux Mint, and have installed the applet “Sound 150%”, which lets you crank it up that far if need be.
I intend on putting Linux Mint Edge edition on the FW when it arrives, scheduled for May 1st.

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This is because on Windows, the slider only controls the power profile when on battery, on AC the laptop is always on “performance”. To lower the temperature on AC power you can navigate to the power options, set the “processor power management” to 99% max.

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I’ll give that a try, thanks. I haven’t messed around with the power settings at all yet, except to set my preferences for what happens when I close the lid/press the power button.

I’m using Ubuntu but haven’t updated the BIOS yet. It’s on the TODO list…

My top bits of feedback so far:

  • I wish the trackpad sat flat. Its corners stick up and they’re kind of sharp.
  • I wish the trackpad had discrete buttons so I could turn off “tap to click”. So much easier to use that way.

And a huge one so far:
Why the wasted space next to the up arrows? There was perfectly good space to put page up and page down keys. Fn+Arrow basically means I’m constantly having to raise my hands to use the trackpad to scroll because there’s no good pgup/pgdn.

I was hoping to replace my Dell E6x40 I’d used for forever without losing anything. But, alas, that was a better keyboard.

Numpad is good, screen is great, guts seem to work well so far, etc. But for a “luxury” device, I had expected more polish on the input modules.

OK, good, not just me. Disappointing.

EDIT: Attaching images of trackpad. I didn’t see them anywhere in as far up the thread as I went.


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If I understand that right, I don’t have it. the trackpad is all inside a slight depression and no sharp edges.
I am not using it anyway. I am using a bluetooth logitech mouse. Much better than a touchpad IMO. But the touchpad is good for a backup and travel…

Image added (to my previous post).

I would reach out to Support about that. or try to bend it back, but with that you are risking breaking it and not having it covered under warranty.

That’s pretty bad. I think the general fit and finish issues of the input modules and spacers are common, but having the touchpad module corners stick up like that is unacceptable in my opinion.

One thing to double check is that all of your mid plate screws are fully screwed in. If any of them are sticking up, that can lead to misalignment of the modules. I had an issue when I had missed screw 14 while reassembling, and it caused the left spacer to pop up a bit.