I plan on getting a Framework 13 as a replacement for my old 2018 Matebook X Pro.
In case it’s relevant, I want to use 1x USB-C, 2x USB-A and 1x MicroSD, 32 GB RAM, and run Kubuntu LTS or KDE Neon (Ubuntu LTS based), wayland, and probably 150% fractional scaling.
Now there is the choice between Ryzen 7640U and Core i5 1340P, and I have a few questions:
How is power consumption when idle or under very light load? My goal is to at least stay on the level of the Mateboox X Pro: 4 W idle at 20% screen brightness, and 2.5 W with screen off, but playing music over Bluetooth.
From what I read in the forums, idle power should defintely be fine with the 1340P, but not necessarily on the 7640U, at least without tuning. I am willing to do some tuning, but don’t want to sacrifice responsivity or connectivity (I had some bad experiences with tune-all tools on this).
I haven’t found anything specifically on power use when playing audio over Bluetooth, but I read that the AMD wireless card seems to be quite power hungry.
Does anyone have more info, or is willing to test regarding Bluetooth? I have the impression my AMD info might be outdated, there appear to be many improvements with newer BIOS or kernel versions.
Is undervolting a thing on either the 7640U or the 1340P? It really helped on my Matebook X Pro.
How is the noise? I read in reviews that the laptop is rather loud.
I have no problem limiting the CPU to 20 W or maybe a little less. Is the noise still bad then?
Does the fan turn on quickly? I don’t like the fan spinning up on a short 10 second burst load, and really enjoy my Matebook staying silent for a minute or so under load (the cooling system has good connection to the case for spreading the heat, and the fan only turns on above a certain temperature).
Does charging work with a simple phone charger? My Matebook X Pro works with everything I tried, and even a 5 W charger helps to at least not discharge while reading a PDF.
Well, only the used tech to produce the CPU would already tell me that the AMD CPU is way better in terms of efficiency than the Intel one is: 4nm vs 10nm …
I had Intel CPU’s so far, but the GPU was just a GPU for displaying something, nothing more.
The AMD CPU has a fairly powerful GPU builtin. My daughter uses her FW13 to play some games online with her friends and that works fairly well (Usual suspects Overwatch & Co.).
As always, configuring the system is important. So far, she can hold the power for a full day at university. And knowing how she uses it, that is a lot. As she is at university, no Bluetooth for audio though. So can’t talk about that part.
In general, you won’t hear the FAN’s except if you do some power intensive things (compiling kernel on all cores, ripping some DVD’s). Writing docs, Browsing the net etc. does not even get the fan started.
In terms of chargers. Take the framework provided charger and cable.
Cheap chargers and cables can be incompatible. It is not a: plug in, and current flows. It is a Plug in, USB-C protocol will negotiate the capabilities and then start charging if that possibility exists.
So - it can work, but it does not have to. A 60W charger is required for decent charging capability though.
I have a 7640U fw13 and use Ubuntu 23.10 with stock kernel 6.5 (beware, not supported my framework but I moved to this laptop a ssd from another one and I didn’t want to reinstall). I have some indirect experience of last gen Intel having a relative and some coworkers with 12/13th gen intel process laptops (but U and P series, both windows and linux user) but none of those is a framework.
I have applied some but not all tinkering suggested on this forum and in framework guides. I get a power consumption(reported by powerstat) slightly higher than the values you seek (5W now writing, 3W playing local music with screen off). But I saw others in the forum have reported values both lower than mine and than your goals. Actually I think I could achieve lower consumption values putting some time into it, or maybe after a system reinstall/upgrade.
I think these AMD chips had some software/driver/firmware issues, on linux at least. But they looks like they are been addressed and fixed with time.
I don’t think with Intel you’d require any tinkering. I haven’t seen anyone reporting so many problems on this forum. Still I’m uninformed in this regard.
One big disappointment for me is the power consumption when just playing videos. In that use case Intel is more efficient. You find some discussion about these issue on this forum and on freedesktop’s gitlab. Some work is being done to address it but I won’t land in Ubuntu 24.04 for sure even with kernel upgrade as it requires changes to compositors.
The mesa+kernel graphics driver, after last BIOS update, has always been stable and performant.
Hardly. Both 7640U and 7840U do NOT support PBO. I thought Intel didn’t support undervolting in any laptop chip without an X in the name, but, since you where able to undervolt a U-series chips maybe you can find a way.
From my experience quieter than all 12/13th intel laptops I have encountered at work/home (Again, none are framework, but some are premium laptop from major brand with U-series processor which are supposed to be efficient. If fan noise is an indication of power consumption, they are not efficient except maybe at idle/light-load). I decided I wouldn’t buy a Intel 13th framework after those laptops became the background noise at my work desk.
Still, I find this laptop of mine too loud sometimes (even doing not heavy stuff). Once I limit the TDP is fine for me. But there is no right way to do it with amd on linux. I wrote about it here.
Meanwhile I think with Intel you can limit the TDP with the RAPL interface (confirmation needed).
Want is quickly for you? I think the fan curve is fine. It does not turn on and off too often, but that’s very subjective.
I have no USB-C charger without USB-PD to test. With last BIOS updates the laptop works fine with my 18W and 45W chargers. But I don’t think “dumb chargers” will work. Take a look at
With regards to Intel fw13 I don’t know. Both the USB chips and the EC are different on the Intel version, so even dumb charger might maybe work.
That’s some old marketing from chip fabs. Even TSMC now calls this fab process “N4 family”. No transistor in “TSMC N4” is 4nm small and no transistor in “Intel N7”/“Intel 10nm” is 10nm small. I too think that AMD has the better and efficient chips but not just because 4 is better than 10. And doesn’t mean in real life uses case amd chips will always perform better (see the linux hw decode higher power consumption).
I totally agree. I’ve spent very little time gaming with my laptop but I tried some different stuffs (not just online multiplayer) and I find that the 7640U handled them pretty well. Also no game crash related to cpu/gpu.
Well, only the used tech to produce the CPU would already tell me that the AMD CPU is way better in terms of efficiency than the Intel one is: 4nm vs 10nm …
Right, though this is more relevant at high power output.
When (almost) idle though, there are also other things like being able to switch off cores (iirc someone reported saving 0.7W on Intel with this), and the apparently power hungry AMD WiFi card.
In general, you won’t hear the FAN’s except if you do some power intensive things (compiling kernel on all cores, ripping some DVD’s). Writing docs, Browsing the net etc. does not even get the fan started.
Thanks, that’s promising. How long does it take for the fan to turn on? I just tested and on my current laptop with 20W from CPU the fan starts only after 2 minutes (and then initially at very low speed).
Something similar would be great, even if it’s just one minute of silence.
Cheap chargers and cables can be incompatible
I do have a nice 60W charger at home, but 2-3 times a year I’m in a situation where I have nothing available but some cheap 5W charger, and so far my laptop never failed to charge there (slowly, but at least charge).
5W now writing, 3W playing local music with screen off
5W while writing sounds good, that’s also what I currently get. The 4W are only after doing nothing for ~20 seconds.
Regarding playing music I have to say I’m a little afraid of the reportedly power hungry AMD wireless card (that’s why I explicitly asked about BT audio).
I think these AMD chips had some software/driver/firmware issues, on linux at least. But they looks like they are been addressed and fixed with time.
That’s also the impression I got from reading in the forums, where the better results I found on this are rather recent.
One big disappointment for me is the power consumption when just playing videos
This is unexpected, how much is it for FHD h264? My current laptop is around 7-8W as far as I remember, which is not particularly good.
Once I limit the TDP is fine for me. But there is no right way to do it with amd on linux. I wrote about it here.
Oh, that’s very unexpected… I thought power limiting was normal on modern CPUs (at least going down from default limits).
Want is quickly for you? I think the fan curve is fine. It does not turn on and off too often, but that’s very subjective.
Ideally I would be able to have it similar to currently, which is the fan turning on only after 2 min of loading the CPU using 20W. That’s when only starting from a cool case (~25°C at the keyboard).
But I don’t think “dumb chargers” will work. Take a look at […]
Thanks for the link, this is a clear advantage for Intel, at least for 11th gen: AMD Framework USB-C charger compatibility issues - #174 by Tom1.
I really hope it can be fixed as indicated in the last post.
[Edit]: I just saw BIOS 3.05 mentions “Fix compatibility issue with some low wattage chargers.”, when the tests above were on 3.03b.
My test above was done with BT earbuds. Just a local file. No internet music streaming.
I played a 1920x800 video with mpv. DE is GNOME. PPD set to power. Power consumption is 6.5-8W: fullscreen is a little lower, window is a little higher, BT or computer speaker audio does not look much different.
My understanding is that the EC update 3.03b was only released as beta and was incorporated into BIOS release 3.05.
My test above was done with BT earbuds. Just a local file. No internet music streaming.
Oh sorry, I overlooked that. Thanks for testing, that was a big concern actually.
I played a 1920x800 video with mpv. DE is GNOME. PPD set to power. Power consumption is 6.5-8W
Thanks again. I just re-tested, on my PC it’s 5.5W in a small window, and 7W full screen.
But I don’t watch enough videos when on battery to really care about this…
My test above was done with BT earbuds. Just a local file. No internet music streaming.
I played a 1920x800 video with mpv. DE is GNOME. PPD set to power. Power consumption is 6.5-8W: fullscreen is a little lower, window is a little higher, BT or computer speaker audio does not look much different.
My understanding is that the EC update 3.03b was only released as beta and was incorporated into BIOS release 3.05.
