Terrifying.
4 Likes
If I’m not mistaken, the AMD 7000 series, at least the desktop counterparts, are designed to push as hard as they can until hitting 100C. And are designed to be able to remain at 100C indefinitely.
I would assume the reason there’s not much of a change is because the framework team have made the thermal hardware able to handle the power limits, since there’s no point to trying to get the temps down when AMD designed the CPUs that way. (At least from a performance and longevity prospective) Stupid if you ask me, but I guess Alaska appreciates AMDs new designs.
2 Likes
I don’t mind the temperature as much, but I couldn’t stomach leaving performance on the table
Don’t do it boys and girls, really don’t do it.
1 Like
Stupid question but: Generally, sometimes we use to re-paste the laptop. There should be no such need with Liquid metal?
LM can fuse into the copper, so one might to add some after time. Since the inital fusion already happend with the stock LM, I don’t expect to redo it - ever.
No disagreement, you’re probably right!
Not Framework related, but liquid metal:
When i got my first AMD Ryzen 7 1800x (desktop PC) i did use Thermal Grizley conductonaut liquid metal.
4 years later my PC started to show odd behaviour. In the end it turned out that the liquid metal became solid. I have absolutely no idea how that was even possible.
So yeah, repasting liquid metal is a thing
The FW 16 coldplate is not nickel-plated but raw copper?
You don’t need to use a heat gun to clean off solid old LM - add a little conductonaut to it and you can liquefy it and remove it, ideally by pulling it off with a syringe. Alcohol pads don’t dissolve LM and cotton doesn’t absorb it. If you want something to do that it’s best to use (unheated!) solder wick.
Don’t do LM if you’re scared of it. I’ve used it on laptops for years (including an intel 12th gen FW and my 13 inch AMD FW) and been fine. These laptops get daily use, tossed in backpacks, no issues.
Copper isn’t susceptible to alloying with gallium the same way aluminum is, but some grades of copper (even certain finishes) will take in a tiny bit. I’ve seen some copper coldplates completely unaffected and some discolor immediately. Good LM uses an absolute minimum of gallium to maintain the liquid state and once enough is drawn out of it the bulk can solidify at room temp. This actually won’t affect temps in a lot of cases unless it crystallizes in a funky way, like there’s uneven heatsink pressure or some other mechanical issue.
1 Like
correct
Okay, I had a look at the “Liquid Metal Deep Dive” e-mail from December again, it is mentioned there that a “vapor chamber copper plate” sits above the processor package, I also found out that the used “Coollaboratory Liquid MetalPad” is in fact gallium-free and therefore is (according to the website: Coollaboratory Liquid MetalPad – Coollaboratory) compatible with both aluminum and copper coldplates, and shouldn’t need any repaste/replacement in a FW 16’s lifetime - at least if it has been applied properly in the factory to begin with. @samokosik
@Christian_Elsner Regarding “On the heatsink there are small hexagonal shapes imprinted into the copper”, the e-mail specified this about the coldplate surface: “An etched pattern in the surface of the vapor chamber holds the liquid metal through tension”.
4 Likes
Same for the 13, ptm is very worth it though and gets you most of the perks of lm without all the risks.
Doing 45W indefinitely on the 13 after I figured out how to get around the stupid stapm limit is pretty neat though XD
1 Like
How did you get around the stapm limit? Ive been trying to figure it out on my 16 and it has been a bit frustrating.
If mine has the high heat issues, its getting a fresh coat of noctua thermal grease. I got a large tube when I build my desktop, and have plenty left. Just for games, I don’t want to risk something that could short my motherboard.
Smokeless umaf, I posted the my settings here may need adjustments for the 16 though.
What are the stock stapm limits on the 16 anyway?
Stapm throttling wasn’t really a problem with the stock paste though as it stayed under the limit anyway, not sure how that works with the 16.
1 Like
My issue is even though my system is at around 75c when boosting at 54 watts for a long period of time, stapm eventually limits me down to 45-46 watts
On the 13 stapm throttling only happens above 80C so this may be a different issue, assuming you are looking at the right sensor of course.
Noted, going to look into smokeless a bit more. I just know that my unit will go down to 45 watts even though it was running great at 50-55 watts. I manually set the slow boost to as long as possible with UXTU but I thought that STAPM would be my issue
Before you start messing with hidden settings it may be a good idea to identify what kind of throttling is actually happeing first. If it’s stapm throttling you can actually watch the stapm value slowly decrement (using ryzenadj -i for example) while the chip is above 80c.
Are you sure the actual chip temperature is 75C in your case? What sensor value are you looking at?