The Thinkpad X200 series is significantly larger than the Framework 13. They also put in a much smaller trackpad in order to fit all those function keys into the large keyboard.
The Framework is compromising on the number of function keys in exchange for a larger trackpad. Unless if the majority of people require these constantly using these four keys and are unable to work with the Fn key + shortcuts, only then will Framework likely consider making the change to their keyboard.
The only option available right now is still reprogramming keys.
Having owned an X201s and X220, they were not larger than the FW13, and they fit in a much better keyboard. I’d gladly trade a better keyboard for a somewhat smaller touchpad, but I honestly don’t think it’s necessary. You could fairly easily fit in the required keys with the current touchpad.
I understand that it would be an endeavour to design a new keyboard, but in my mind the keyboard layout is now FW13’s biggest flaw - much more so than I anticipated it would be.
I’ll look into Windows remapping, though that’s not a great substitute for real keys. Fn+ combinations are not adequate at all, since they effectively prevent one-handed operation for most functions (and I have very large hands).
That certainly won’t fly for the vast majority of users today. The X200 is from 16 years ago. If you want to talk about fitting in extra keys like PgUp, PgDn, Home, End, I’d say at least use a modern example.
Okay. Same argument for Lenovo Yoga 370, which is the computer I’m leaving for this one. Or the X1 Titanium, which my spouse has. Both have better keyboard layouts and are a similar size.
I guess it’s hard for some to visualize if you’ve never seen it in person, side-by-side to compare to the FL13. Here’s a photo I took just now. Note: The perspective from camera lens has made the ThinkPad ‘look’ not as wide…but it’s actually the nearly identical in width (X200 width 11 and 9/16 inches) :
The X200 keyboard is taller, extra row…but if you ignore the shifted-down arrow keys (because they’ve offset to the side)…then the touchpad only needs to be a bit shorter (less than 10-12mm shorter). Plus, honestly, I never fully understood the need for a ‘large’ touchpad…because I only use a small portion of it, a portion of the time (I’m mostly a mouse person). Finger travel distance…why make it a long distance exercise?
If they are going to sell a haptic touchpad, I believe they would probably just add it into the existing input cover and sell a new trackpad on the Framework Marketplace for people who want to purchase it
One issue though might be the extra height due to having to add in the haptic motors. There would probably also need to be new connectors so that they can supply power to the haptic trackpad.
The Framework Laptop 16 would probably be easier to create a haptic trackpad for although the height issue is still present.
Unless my lying eyes are deceiving me, I see 30cm width for the Framework and 27.5cm width for the Thinkpad. Or, about an inch less width on the Thinkpad.
Yeah, that will likely be the case if they have a touchpad upgrade. Though i would also like a keyboard upgrade (7-row).
There’s another thread regarding wanting a thicker chassis for the FL13. Let me see if I can locate that. Here.
See the note I added in that post. It’s a camera perspective thing. The two are almost near identical in width to within 1/8 of an inch.
Here’s another shot. Here, due to the relatively more rounded corners, it’s almost as if the FL13 is not as wide…but in fact, Framework is 1/8 of an inch wider:
When you start setting the requirements, designing, prototyping, sourcing…etc…that’s another year (especially when there’s parallel product development).
To me, “near” or “far” is based on need rather than time. (Functional need, to fill a functional gap…or quality of life gap kind of thing). But I can see what you mean if you’re on the product development side, having to pay for tooling…etc
I had exactly the same problem on the framework 16. I reprogrammed an RGB macropad to provide the home, end page up and down and it works well. The main keyboard on the 16 uses the same rp2040 as the macropad so maybe the 13 does as well. I didn’t use qmk, I wrote my own macro firmware, you might be able to do the same.
I’m afraid the FWL16 is currently unique in using a rp2040 and qmk. The FWL13 handles the keyboard like normal laptops do, within the EC (Embedded Controller) on the mainboard. Though Framework’s EC code is open source & on their github, so anyone can modify themselves if they have the skill.
For most people, a more accessible solution for doing fancy key remapping on the FWL13 would be an advanced OS level remapper, one which offers keyboard layers. On Linux I know there is keyd, kmonad, kbct, probably others.
That’s interesting. Does the on run some firmware or does the laptop scam the keys?
Yes Linux does.have key remapping. I looked at that but wanted unshifted keys that the hardware didn’t have. It could swap keys though.
The latter. The keymatrix is directly connected to the mainboard. Key scanning is done there, within the EC. The keyboard cable connects first to the touchpad board on the FWL13, but it just passes the unchanged raw signals right on through to the cable connected to the mainboard.
