Liquid Metal vs thermal paste

Did you control Fan speeds (is There even an Option on the framework)?

If not, how was the difference in Sound volume between the different TIMs?
Thanks for your work. Maybe I will settle for kryonaut, it seems to be a great improvement over the Stock paste

@devryd I let the stock fan profile do its thing. I’m not sure how to adjust it yet because I have not had the need. I’m in a fairly noisy environment and have no good way to gauge the sound level. At idle the fan is pretty much inaudible, any time the temp is over 70C for ~30 seconds its ramped up to full speed as far as I can tell.

Anyone know what the fan curve and delay is? Is it in the EC code?

As far as I know, the fan doest run at idle at all.
I was wondering if there was a difference at the high end, because fan speed is often related to temperature. If the fan was spinning slower with the liquid metal, the delta in temperature would be even higher if the fan speed was fixed.

And what was your ambient temperature?

Warm-ish, I don’t have a way to measure it with me. Its been constant all day though.

That explains it.
I have a 20°C ambient temperature and mine idles at around 37°C with the stock thermal paste.

Edit: This is the temperature for the package, the cores idle at around 32-33°C

Edit 2: I just noticed, that you have the i7 variant. That explains the difference in temperature

So I just switched my i5 framework to using conductonaut as the laptop was overheating after playing daggerfall unity for too long. Unfortunately I couldn’t find a good benchmark suite on gentoo to capture good data like AIDA64 so my data is pretty much just running sensors with a stress-ng burnin.

Anyways with stock I was getting thermal throttling with 1 core hitting 100c and the others around 85c-90c. Obviously with the thermal throttling the fan was autoed to 100%

After switching to liquid metal I’m getting much better temps. This was the first time I’ve ever done a liquid metal install (Gamers Nexus has pretty good videos on what to do) and I’m quite impressed with the results. With liquid metal and the same burnin test I’m seeing all cores around 75c and fan speeds are noticeably lower and quieter.

If you are willing to risk bricking your mainboard for better temps and quieter loads, I would recommend taking the plunge

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Its a little wierd, that your framework runs so hot. I cant get mine even close to throtteling with synthetic loads. Gaming should be less stressful that stresstest tools. From which batch is your framework?

You are running linux, if I see that correctly. Did you change any power settings for the CPU?
I just ran prime95 and furmark and never got above 80°C with my i5 framework

I was in Batch 4, the existing thermal paste appeared to be applied correctly when I replaced it with liquid metal. If anything there was more paste than necessary but that’s way better than not enough paste.
My kernel only has ‘performance’ and ‘schedutil’ cpufreq governors built and ‘performance’ is enabled by default. P-states are enabled and stress-ng is taking advantage of that with the --ignite-cpu flag

I am not familiär with that Tool. How much Power is the CPU allowed to draw during the stress test?

Performance will pin the cpufreq at max which I guess is 4.2GHz for these i5’s. As far as I’m aware there is nothing on this machine that would prevent the CPU from running as fast as it can

I assume stress-ng with ignite is more aggressive than prime95. Probably closer to IntelBurnTest

Linus Tech Tips made a video a few weeks ago where they tested different Stress test tools. Why Overheat your CPU on Purpose? - YouTube
They found that prime95 put out the most heat on intel. This test was done on windows though, which means I have no comparison for stress-ng.
Can you get a power reading from your system?

During stress-ng the battery is discharging 3301mA at 13.997V so… 42.6W it looks like

under prime95, my system pulls 43W from the battery, about the same as yours. The highest temperature I measured with the stock thermal paste is 81°C.
Its a little wierd that your framework runs so much warmer.

A good alternative to liquid metal with ~ same cooling perfomance is the honeywell tpm 7950 thermal pad (its not a normal thermal pad because if themperature goes up it gets liquid like thermal paste).

Here a video from LinusTechTips: Reddit told me to buy this – PTM7950 Thermal Pad - YouTube

There are more vids on youtube, just type name of it vs liquid metal. But i linked this one, because there you can see it can get “liquid” like thermal paste (not like liquid metal). So i think it’s great for CPU and GPU, but im not sure you want to use it for example on vrm like a thermalpad, because probably it will just melt. But im not sure about that.

It seems to be as good as liquid metal and it’s said to be last long and dont try out like thermal paste. So seems to be perfect for laptops. But it’s expensiv.

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@Michael_Wu et al have provided a well-researched and documented examination of PTM 7950 and its use with Framework 13s: [Honeywell PTM7950 Phase Change Thermal Pads/Sheets] Application, Tips, and Results

Dino

edit: I borked the link. Now fixed.

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Yeah, I’ll toss in my support for PTM7950. On my framework laptop it dropped my temperature running s-tui by ~8℃ and on my steam deck it increased my FPS on the dying light 2 video setting performance test by ~5 FPS. Its non-conductive and framework has a nice metal rectangle cage around the area with the CPU so you’re not going to have to worry about it damaging things. I’m going to put this stuff on everything I can.

The only cooling-related issue I came across is a couple months after applying it, my fan started doing an eerily perfect imitation of a spinning rust hdd but I have no reason to suspect it had anything to do with the PTM7950 (my theory is maybe I mishandled the fan when it was out of the laptop or the bearing in the fan was just crap to begin with. No idea which it is, and no way to tell, so I bought my own replacement fan instead of contacting support.)

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Have you seen any tests, where ptm7950 and lm are directly compared?
I havent seen any direct comparison, sadly