After Complete Power discharge - slow boot, no camera or bluetooth, expansion cards do not work

Framework Laptop 13 Linux
1

Which Linux distro are you using?

Guix OS

Which release version?
(if rolling release without a release version, skip this question)

(If rolling release, last date updated?)

Which kernel are you using?

linux 6.17

Which BIOS version are you using?

latest - 3.09

Which Framework Laptop 13 model are you using? (AMD Ryzen™ AI 300 Series, AMD Ryzen™ 7040 Series, Intel® Core™ Ultra Series 1, 13th Gen Intel® Core™ , 12th Gen Intel® Core™, 11th Gen Intel® Core™)

13th Gen Intel Core

After a complete power discharge the laptop boots slowly and if expansion cards are installed logs show - usb failed to enumerate messages. Bluetooth and camera are not recognised and no usb drives are detected. Poweroff has to be done by long press on the power button, suspend does not work.

This problem has been seen before on the forums and I have followed the various guides to reset the mainboard etc all to no avail.
If the expansion cards are not installed then boot up is normal with bluetooth and camera recognised.

I have been back and forth with Support carrying out the tests they requested. My laptop had been out of warranty one month when this occurred, Support helpfully sent a new motherboard as an exception. This however does not work and the symptoms remain.

Does anyone have any idea what the problem might be.

I am certain that the problem is not OS related. The laptop has functioned well with Guix. Rolling back to earlier versions made no difference. I updated the Bios to the latest version - this made no difference. I attached an expansion card which had not been in the laptop when the symptoms first occurred. This was not recognised - I infer that none of the cards are damaged.

I cannot of course check with a Fedora or Ubuntu live usb since I now have no way to mount it.

If anyone has any suggestions I would be pleased to hear them.

Thanks

David

1 Like
2

You know what’s so weird? I have a FW16 and I’m running Linux Mint 22.2, and when I upgraded the kernel to kernel 6.17, I had the exact same things happen to me. What I did to force it to work was remove the 6.17 kernel and had the system boot from the 6.14 kernel. Is there any way that you can change the kernel to the 6.14 one to see if maybe it’s a kernel issue?

3

With guix you can rollback to previous configs which have earlier kernels, this made no difference. Also since the laptop exhibited the problems the day after running normally and with no change in the OS, it does not seem to be an OS problem

1 Like
4

Shoot, I don’t know what the issue is then. Maybe it could be an EC problem, I also had an issue with that, but I’m not sure 100%: If you go into BIOS, there should be an option for battery disconnect. You can select it and exit saving changes while on battery, which will disconnect it momentarily. Then, wait for about 5–10 seconds, then plug in the laptop and boot if off of AC power.

I hope that it works!

5

I have tried that too, no luck. Resetting bios to default values also has no effect. I am puzzled that the replacement board does not resolve the issue. I am wondering if it is a power supply problem from the chassis.

1 Like
6

I’m sure that all the power supply issues are either from the board itself or the AC adapter. Maybe check the USB-C tongue on the power adapter and see if maybe it’s cracked or if the pins are bent in the port. Maybe the power negotiation is going wrong. Also, check the ports on the motherboard to see if they are damaged aswell

7

Thank you for taking the time to reply. None of the pins in the USB connectors are bent or dirty and the usb connector from the power seems to be OK too. All four of the USB connectors are not being recognised and the problem does not go away when the laptop is started on battery power alone. That suggests to me that somewhere on the chassis with the power delivery to the board there is a problem. Technical support have not suggested anything like this though.

8

I’d suggest trying to boot on battery with no expansion cards, then add one at a time and try to boot again, It is possible you have a damaged expansion card causing USB errors. Power delivery is handled by the mainboard and you said you got a replacement. The only other USB devices are the keyboard, trackpad, bluetooth technically, and camera. I suppose one of them could be causing the issue as well.

9

When I boot with no expansion cards the camera and bluetooth are there as usual. I have tried booting with one card in all the slots and used different cards in each slot, very irritating given the slow boot each time. In all cases no change. The key thing though is that I had a card which I had left at home when travelled to NZ and when booting with this card in any slot the problem persists. This is what suggests to me that the cards are not the problem.

Thanks for the suggestion.

10

So you’re saying that it boots fine without a single expansion card installed but if you add just one of any of your expansion cards USB stops working? You said the keyboard doesn’t work, so technically you don’t even need to boot to see if the keyboard is working, just spam the f2 key to enter bios, if you can’t get into bios then the keyboard isn’t working.

11

Sorry I was not clear enough

If I boot with any extension card bluetooth and camera are not recognised, the keyboard and touchpad are, and none of the cards are visible ( eg via lsusb) I can’t attach pen drives in the usbA card for example. When cards are in place the logs show unable to enumerate usb entries on several of the ports, booting is very slow as the laptop is obviously trying to connect to the cards and failing.

12

Be careful with the “lsusb” command, because “sudo lsusb -v” kills the USB chip and it needs a reboot.

At least is kills it on my FW16 7840HS. Maybe the FW13 you have is different, but just an idea.

13

I’d suggest pulling the wifi card and disconnecting the camera and see if it still has that issue. After that the only other USB devices that could be causing an issue would be the keyboard and trackpad.

14

Noted, thanks

15

Turbo

I have disconnected the wifi before, perhaps i’ll try the camera as well, reboot and see if that makes a difference, thanks

16

Well I guess I forgot the fingerprint reader, that is also USB.

17

turbo

I disconnected the camera and wifi module and , for the first time , there was a normal boot with the USB-C card in place. A reboot with USB-C and USB-A cards failed. I have now replaced the camera and wifi and this time, with the USB-C card in place, it reboots quickly, bluetooth wifi and camera also being picked up.

I wonder why this change? - thanks for the pointer

1 Like
18

Oops

spoke too soon, no camera is showing - it was a tricky little ribbon cable connection so i’ll go back and check that

1 Like
19

I have reseated the ribbon cable and the laptop successfully boots with the usb expansion card, camera, wifi, bluetooth all detected and working. Still can’t get two cards to boot properly

20

The ISL9241 that converts PD input to rail voltage is on the mainboard. Replacing the mainboard replaces it. If it doesn’t fix the problem, something not on the mainboard is causing the problem. It could be camera, audio board, WiFi card, the battery, one or more of the expansion cards.

The USB-C card is just an extension cable. The USB-A card has components that triggers 5V from the mainboard

Try booting with USB-C and other cards such as HDMI(if any) but without any USB-A card