Can’t wait 
The one N350 convertible I can think of with official Linux support is the StarLite 5, but that has the same price tag as the FW12, and it’s actually more of a tablet.
Right. If I’m being honest (much as I don’t want it to be true), I don’t see the 12 getting any high performance upgrades. The CEO mentioned how he wants each product to be the best for its target, and the 12 is both too expensive and not powerful enough.
Knowing the audience for the 12, it’s clear the company will choose price over performance. Higher performance will cannibalise the 13, price the 12 out of its target market, and still fail to meet the 13’s performance targets considering there isn’t the physical space for dual channel RAM or a bigger battery.
The best I can see is that next year Framework offers an AMD 7040 series mainboard for the 12, considering the 7040 series is about the same age as the Intel 1315u: it’ll still offer better performance. But it still won’t match the 13 mainboards as it lacks the dual channel RAM.
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I find it amusing that everyone is comparing the Framework 12 to Chromebooks because it appears to be targeted towards the Educational Market, however this assumes a U.S. based focus on their target market. Framework is a small company, the market share they need for a design to be successful is tiny. Since they essentially follow a CI/CD mindset, and since the vast majority of their SKU’s are perpetual vs ephemeral standard analysis of what makes a successful product for them by people not privy to their accounting ledgers is generally going to be severely flawed. The U.S. EDU market is very likely not their primary target, the European market is a much more likely landing point for the product as ChromeOS runs into numerous issues with privacy concerns, envrionmental impact, and optics at this time when European governments are distancing themselves from U.S. tech giants. My belief is the Framework 12 will be a very successful product for Framework in the short and long term.
As to any suppositions on QC, we have seen design changes resulting in iterative generational improvements. You would be hard pressed to show any real correlation between the parts issues you see in the forums outside of Gen1 product and the normal 1-3% you would see for any other product. I for instance with a 12th gen Framework 13 had zero QC issues, and the vast majority of users are likely in the same boat. Without seeing their internal documents tracking items such as this any comments here are purely speculative and error prone.
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realised this comment got quite long so heres a starlite 5 review ig:
Its 100% more a tablet, I have the older version, based on the chasis it seems the same and likely has the same shortcoming. I bought first batch when it was very cheap (same price as a pixel tablet) so I wont say it was bad value.
I also waited 7-9 months from the preorder…
However to put it plainly, the keyboard case thing is awful. Its the same quality as those $50 ipad 9 cases you would get on amazon. Had the pins that hold it in place snap so it slides left and right along the rail when in use. Multiple of the keys don’t stick to the switches correctly so they pop and the touchpad is mediocre. The pins broke in the second month and the keyboard switches have always been dodgy. I think they may have fixed the alignment pins in newer versions but I haven’t got confirmation.
Ignoring the keyboard I’d probably go with the protective case and use it as a tablet only. Its a fantastic tablet, I got the 3k screen version which is discontinued but the quality is awesome and id imagine the 2k screen on new batches would also be good, with the slightly better perf of the n305 it would be a pretty good ipad pro alternative (since thats what the price is closer to now)
Anyways, I managed to brick it in a firmware update and need to get a reflashing tool 
Looking forward to the Framework 12 since it has slightly better specs (the n200 wasnt really an issue for me) and an attached keyboard lets me use it on my lap in a similar form factor.
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You’re right, I was being a little hand wavy; harder can mean more brittle.
Every design choice has tradeoffs.
Am I the only one that thinks LPCAMM2 is an absolute no-brainer for the 12 as a motherboard upgrade?
It’s an open standard, tiny, and completely replaceable down to the pin pads. It would make it so a high-end motherboard could be justified for the 12. I’d personally love to see it.
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If they can’t afford a 5$ redriver to get usb4/tb they probably also can’t aford the early adboter tax of lpcamm2 on the 12.
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They can just charge more for the motherboard. That’s why I said “high end”
Most people seem to want a 12 but with a better motherboard and screen, and are probably willing to pay more, I know I am.
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Multi-channel memory, USB4/TB, maybe AMD; one can dream.
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Not with the limited availability combined with the outrageous prices Framework charges for memory and storage from themselves.
Totally fair. It’s really easy to get excited at the idea of cramming the latest and greatest chips into this chassis with all the recent excitement around ARM and Strix Halo. A better display option with fixed QC issues would be higher priority.
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CJ (Elevated Systems) makes a great point in his YouTube comments: Framework has been around for years now- at what point can people keep excusing these QC issues and the slow support team?
After all, System76 or Tuxedo could gladly take Framework’s place for repairable Linux laptops, while Windows users would be stuck with hit-or-miss Lenovo (or give up on repairability and just go to Apple.)
I’m nervous- I want Framework to do well. I hope they choose their next moves wisely, whatever the right moves even are.
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fair.
I think you have to really care about repairability to justify any framework computer. (it’s the one thing they do perfectly Imo and better than anyone else, they cannot be beat.)
They’re all extremely overpriced compared to the competition, with generally worse specs and worse build quality.
Some of the stuff Framework does is a bit worrying to be honest.
I also get it though, Not taking advantage of what is essentially slave labor in order to manufacture a product is expensive. It’s just a tough sell to people who expect the best for cheap. Normal people don’t care about the ethics of the laptop they buy, and will buy another sweat shop machine when the last disposable one dies.
I hope Framework survives a long time and can slowly change people’s views on consumer electionics.
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These QC issues only really exist in Gen1 products and are generally fixed by the time Gen2 of a product comes out. The rest fall into the 1-3% range that is always going to be there for any product.
System 76 is rebranded Clevo just like Tuxedo … neither has a great track record for durability or longevity of parts. Why would WIndows user be stuck with just Lenovo? and Apple makes a great product if you don’t mind being shackled. For some users that is just great.
They are doing well. I suspect the Framework 12 and Framework Desktop are going to be very good sellers for them, and they will then have four product lines with a tenth of the SKU’s other manufacturers would have. Framework is a very lean, low overhead company based on all appearances.
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I agree, to a point. Just because the company is “new,” that isn’t an excuse for poor customer service and poor quality. He should absolutely reach out to support about some of those issues, and they should address them.
I’ve had my own struggles with tech support, so I know it isn’t perfect. However, I’ve also had several interactions that were quick and effective. So it isn’t all bad.
Another thing to consider. Whether new or 20 years old, a company of 60 employees simply isn’t going to have the kind of resources for research and development, or tech support that a company with 100,000 employees and billions of dollars has. I’m not saying anyone has implied that they should. But it’s just something to keep in mind. Companies like Dell, Lenovo, and Apple have something like 60,000-100,000+ employees.
It’s very possible that System 76 and Tuxedo are similar size companies to Framework. I have no idea what their QC or support process is like, nor how in-depth their engineering of the hardware is, vs. just ordering customized hardware from another large manufacturer. As compared to Framework, who seems to custom design pretty much all of their hardware to meet a very specific mission.
I mostly agree with this as well, but it’s not just repairability. One of the reasons other manufacturers can provide so much lower of a price is because of the mountain of bloatware and near-malware level programs they stuff their machines with in order to collect your data, lock you into various accounts, and advertise you additional products. I know a computer can be “de-bloated,” but I am still very appreciative of companies that offer machines without all that BS (I remember when that was one of the big advertising points of Alienware, before they were bought out by Dell). And it’s no doubt more expensive to sell a machine that isn’t being subsidized by a thousand ads and bundled in “products” that they are surely getting kick-backs from.
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What do you mean exactly by “Gen1”?
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That part was specifically talking about repairability. Lenovo is the best major option for Windows users that I know of, but they’re not perfect. Apple absolutely sucks for repairability, and it’s in System76/Tuxedo’s best interest to supply parts for their rebadged Clevo products. They offer such services and would have no point in existing if they didn’t.
I agree with everything else you said though. Fingers still crossed that this rough launch gets smoothed out as most first-gen/iteration products do
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So the 11th gen Framework was Gen1, the Framework 16 is currently Gen1, the Framework 12 and Desktop are both Gen1. These products will have more issues, a lot of the issues may get resolved during the batch process, but more will get resolved by the time they release a Gen2 product. By the 3rd Generation it looks like mostly iterative improvements with fewer quality issues.
The 11th gen intel based Framework 13 had a lot of problems. The 12th gen intel based Framework 13 (Gen2) had gotten rid of 95% of them and had designed a built in workaround for the biggest one (the draining CMOS battery issue) and that last one was completely resolved in Gen3. The Ultra 155h and the AMD boards for the Framework 13 benefitted from this to the point where we are no longer looking at manufacturing issues, or engineering defects, all of their problems can be narrowed down to firmware, and it is evident that even that is becoming less of a problem. They appear to be on a 3-6 month cadence now for each board and I expect that to improve over time as well.
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Yeah except those parts cease getting made and the churn on those parts is much shorter. You might be able to find boxed parts for those laptops for 3-5 years, after that you are cannibalizing other machines and buying used or third party parts. You can take a Gen1 Framework and have brand new compatible parts now and moving forward.
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