Explainer: Lid rigidity, hinge force, the CNC Top Cover, and the new 4.0kg Hinge Kit

I wonder if/when a touchscreen get offered if the 4kg hinges will be the default for that config?

I’ll be honest, I’m the type that really doesn’t care at all about one-finger opening and would take a stronger, more rigid hinge any day of the week, so I’m slightly sad that you can’t select the 4kg hinges even on the DIY model and that it’s purely an aftermarket item at this time.

I guess I’ll just have to buy all the parts separately from the marketplace and make my own “super DIY” model? :stuck_out_tongue: (my plan was to actually just start with a mainboard on its own as a sort of derpy DIY’d NUC, though not in any sort of fancy housing like Elevated Systems does - I’m fine with bare PCB just sitting around on cardboard or the like)

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that’s a bit of a bummer.

Honestly for 13 inch (even 14 inch, or 15 inch) one-handed opening is never on the “i want that” list.
Look at Dell XPS, for example. None of them are one-handed opening.
The only downside with a stiff hinge is that the chassis will experience more stress when the lid angle is being adjusted.

Well.
3.3Kg/cm is “okay”, and 3.8 is on the stiff part. But 2.8 is just too low.
This is the nature of unadjustable hinges, I guess.
I think the hinge shiuld be made as nominal 3.6Kg/cm with tolerance of ± 0.4kg/cm. Maybe 0.5kg/cm. This way the hinge will never get lower than 3.2kg/cm (which is workable) and higher than 4kg (which is on the stiff part but still workable)

Alternatively, just come up with a adjustable design so we can end this convresation. I don’t care if the hinge cost $30 a pair.

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This, because that’s repairability and sustainability all in one. Not to also mention customizable to each user’s preference.

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At first it seem pretty simple – just make two brackets that are pressed together by a spring so they rotate along one axis while generating friction. However, if you look at the current layout of the display it seems that there isn’t a lot of room to house the mechanism.
Now this is not to say that such a design cannot be done. It absolutely can, but not in a traditional way. (and might include significant extra tooling costs)

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Honestly, Framework focusing engineering efforts on a hinge would be a waste of time, and the design itself would be prone to breaking. Hinges are a weak spot due to the need for them to be actioned every time the laptop is used. Introducing more complexity to their construction increases this inherent weakness. Keeping things as simple as possible is one of the better ways to improve sustainability.

Offering 2 hinges seems like the best way to accommodate the varying opinions of customers.

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To follow form the ‘other’ topic.

I agree that a simple hinge may be less liable to failure, but note second hinge had to be made and I’m pretty sure the ‘resonance’ issue, as acknowledge by Framework is not going anywhere soon.

So in terms of “the metric that I think lends itself to the customer the most” I think a flaky hinge on a laptop is a really bad sign and usability outweighs longevity.

I don’t see how the hinge thing is sustainable and some work on making an adjustable hinge viable.

After all this is use friendly laptop with an unfriendly hinge.

It can’t take that much work to have the hinge adjustable from inside with a small friction screw.

So I agree it’s down to want the user wants, but I have two reasons not to recommend this laptop, the hinges and the RTC battery.

It’s OK for freaks like me but not for the general public.

Unsustainable for mass sales also means it falls far short of what the user wants or expects in what appear to be two very small issues that have a disproportionally large impact.

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I see the 4.0kg hinge as a stop gap workaround at the moment…for the weak 3.3kg hinge. i.e. If one-handed opening is done right, you only need one hinge set (Dell, Lenovo, Apple) for that laptop model.

…due to the lack of resources (combination of time, money, people / experience / skill).

One-handed opening just shouldn’t be a ‘feature’ to start off with. Didn’t (still don’t) have the resources to tune it right, consistently, with high yield.

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Totally agree, that s why I am wishing for a default to 4kg hinge that works always and for long. Instead of a 3kg that works 80% of the time for 1 year…
And later when it is sorted out ad features. (even opening using your voice :smiley: )
Finally I am interested aswell in a futur touch screen and I guess it won t work with 3Kg hinges.
Anyhow, framework is pointing in the right diretion : improvement. Looking forward to receive my framework :santa:

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Note that the hinges are tested to 20,000 cycles. The issue with 3.3kg is not the force setting, but was a “quality escape” from our hinge manufacturer of hinges that were out of spec.

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4.0kg Hinge Kit

Thoughts: The 4.0 kg hinge is absolutely amazing. I now unequivocally recommend the framework since it is actually usable on my lap without the screen falling down!

What Could Be Better
I received and installed the 4.0 kg hinge kit after trying to get in contact with support using the button on their website. I left a detailed message, but nobody responded.

I wish I could have received the replacement part through warranty claim, since I had an earlier batch of frameworks that had extremely weak hinges.

All in all, I am very happy with the product though, and I find it incredible that I could fix the problem myself in less than 30 minutes.

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@nrp Is it at all possible for people buying the 12th gen board / upgrade kit to have a free 4Kg hinge kit optional add-on…as a loyalty reward kind of thing?

I think his answer will be “no” since there was some hinge that, well, are outside of the tolerances set by Framework and thus caused the screen to fall down.
I would love for you to be able to pick your own when configuring one, though.

That’s my point: For those people they would get a 3.3Kg hinge set by warranty anyway.

For people upgrading from 11–>12th gen, they will continue to either stick with the 3.3Kg (if they like the 3.3Kg) [This is upgrade population 1], Or, those don’t even want to try the 3.3Kg…and will go to 4.0Kg [This is upgrade population 2].

For those who fall in the Upgrade population 2:
It will just save Framework Support the time, warehouse packing, shipping to deal with [3.3Kg warranty fulfillment + FedEx shipout → Customer disappointment → Customer order 4.0KG → Fulfillment + FedEx ship out again].

By offering the 4.0Kg kit option for free when upgrading, as loyalty reward, I think it’s a win-win for everyone.

Update: I re-read what you wrote…Think you mean falling inside the acceptable tolerances set by Framework, but unsatisfactory by the customer.

Or, even just a one-time free hinge kit (be it 3.3 or 4.0) when upgrading. This way, everyone gets something that’s definitely in-spec. (Assuming no one abuse this…Don’t go getting something you don’t need)

That’s $32 waived for a $584 (board only), up to $1480 (board and lid) purchase.
5.5%, or as little as 2.16% of the purchase.

It won’t work. The tension must be super high and before you know it the screw strips.
Even with two metallic screw (on separate plates) the tension will still need to be very high. This high tension also means that fragments (of the shaft or the screw) may come off, which is undesireable.

Look at pictures of adjustable hinges. They all have a nut on the side and two circular spring plates pressing together two plates so they have maximum surface area (and circumference) to minimize tension needed

You may be correct and I had considered that, but given my engineering experience I think it may work. Still as my hinges are fine I will only be trying this if they get loose. In fact they seem to be stiffening up over the 4 months of use :slight_smile:

Another idea is to add linseed oil which dries but they may become too stiff over time.

I used organic rapeseed oil, which is a less powerful drying oil than linseed, on the chain bar of my 3 BHP chain saw. After some months the chain became stuck.

Just noticed that the 3.3kg hinge kit on the marketplace has been replaced with a 3.8kg designation. Description still says 3.3kg so maybe a typo? If not, curious if they’ve found a better balance with strength while still allowing one-handed opening.

Yes probably a typo as my understanding is the first iteration of hinges range from 2.8Kg to 3.8Kg the new 3.5Kg to 4.5KG

Thanks for the info. Waiting for the 4 to come back in stock :pensive:

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Am I the only one who thinks that 1Kg ‘range’ per iteration is rather WIDE?

Take the 3.3Kg nominal set for example. Off the assembly line, one unit could be at 3.8, and another unit at 2.8. That’s 25%-35% difference depends on how you look at the numbers.

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Nope, a 1kg range on a 3.3kg target…