Just curious if anyone has any experience, good or bad, with this drive in the 12th Gen Framework.
I do LARGE projects and need the biggest internal drive I can get. My MacBook Pro has 8TB and I run out of space constantly. If there was a bigger drive available I’d get it.
Thanks in advance!
Why limit yourself to a laptop that only has 1 m.2 slot?
For example, this can take 4 m.2 NVMe 2280 PCIe-4x4 drives:
In theory, up to 32TB of storage.
You’re not likely to find experience with a $1,500 SSD in a ~2000 dollar laptop that hasn’t shipped a large portion of it’s orders; however in such a thin laptop high capacity nvme drives are known to frequently throttle or downright cook themselves. It may behoove you to invest in a NAS or external drives at that point, as you’ll get more for the money: and in many cases, programs like Leica Cyclone, Topaz VEAI, Adobe CC, and many others are capable of caching data imported from a slower source onto RAM or a high speed SSD.
Just out of curiosity, what kind of projects or datasets require 8TB of 4x4 bandwidth storage?
He’s from the audio host / DJ / youtuber realm of things.
The laptop will be used for a variety of tasks, ranging from software development across multiple VM’s to 8K footage ingest to live VJ’ing. I won’t be doing anything too computationally heavy on it, nothing Intel QuickSync won’t be able to handle graphics-wise.
VJing and footage ingest are what take the most space. I have about a half a petabyte NAS at my disposal but this laptop will be for use in the field, again for ingest, because I can put install four SD card readers while running on battery, or thunderbolt uplink as well. I don’t even expect the machine to even be able to play back the footage I ingest, just store it for offloading to the NAS for editing later.
For VJing, my current music video library is about 4 TB and I play large events where loud volumes can vibrate USB connections right out of their ports, so external storage is less than ideal.
And the reason I prefer the framework versus an HP or other laptop is the ability to change ports per task as necessary. For footage ingest I can throw a whole bunch of card readers in there, for VJing I can put in dual HDMI ports, and of course all the other benefits that Framework has such as upgradability down the line.
Depends on how much you like port-swapping I guess, as oppose to having the majority of port combination already embedded:
- 1 RJ-45;
- 1 headphone/microphone combo;
- 1 SuperSpeed USB Type-A 5Gbps signaling rate (charging);
- 1 SuperSpeed USB Type-A 5Gbps signaling rate
- 1 power connector;
- 2 Thunderbolt™ 4 with USB4™ Type-C® 40Gbps signaling rate (USB Power Delivery, DisplayPort™ 1.4, HP Sleep and Charge);
- 1 HDMI 2.1;
- 1 Mini DisplayPort™ 2.0
After awhile, you’ll eventually want to carry less cards, swap less, pickup / flip over the laptop less.
I initially thought port swapping was a great idea…but then you’ll soon notice that you’re limited to 4 ports, plus a headphone jack. Anything else, it’s dongle-life. The swapping action is a workflow complication.
What a niche use case! I don’t think you’ll have any clearance issues with the double sided PCB, but I wouldn’t count on sustained read speeds of over 2/3GB for more than a few minutes in such a thin laptop. Very interested in how your machine performs in the field; Please do keep the community updated if you choose to go with Framework!
8Tb stick will be overheated in this laptop. You can attach it with USB 3.2 Gen 2 on speed 2000mb/s if you don’t want to get throttling
I’m not so sure about that. Looking at the power consumption, the average wattage is higher…but the laptop might have sufficient thermal headroom for it.
Temperatures from bench is an open frame chassis in a 22C room, desktop. If it will be placed to laptop i think we can get 90 degress by celsius. Is it good for SSD?
That may or may not be true depending on each laptop model.
The laptop cooling fans are not just for the CPU / GPU. The laptop isn’t air tight all around, and typically not designed to be air tight. In fact, laptops are usually designed with multiple air flow path ways. Internally, air typically get pulled in from multiple areas (key gaps, speaker grills), and passes over various components to cool them. (It would be a design flaw if the only way air can pass in is from the bottom intake grill)
So, without actual test in the Framework laptop, it’s hard to say if the result will go one way or another.
(p.s. and your chart is regarding the Rocket Q…and not the 4 Plus in the OP)
@Christian_Wheel since you haven’t gotten any useful replies yet, I’ll chime in. I’m not using the exact same drive - I’m using an Inland Performance Plus 4TB but it has the same Phison PS5018-E18 controller and is also PCIe 4.0x4 / NVMe 1.4 w/ similar performance characteristics (specced at up to 7GBps read and writes) - it uses Micron 96L TLC vs Sabrent’s Kioxia BiCS5 112L TLC but they both benched at the same 268 MBps/watt power efficiency in Quarch by Toms Hardware so this should give you a good idea of what to expect…
I haven’t done a lot of max-speed writes - my NAS is on a 2.5Gbps LAN so doesn’t get close to hitting the SSD limits, and my fastest microSD cards are UHS-II so again, don’t come close to the SSD limits, so I ran a sequential write stress test for you:
fio --name=write --ioengine=posixaio --rw=write --bs=1m --size=16g --numjobs=1 --iodepth=1 --runtime=600 --time_based --end_fsync=1
nvme-clito monitor, it seems to throttle at about 78C for me (a review says it throttles at 75C so looks like it’ll overshoot a bit) after running for about 4-5 minutes. When I’m running
fio my Framework the fans max out btw and my 1260P actually gets a workout (I am running encrypted BTRFS though, so this may be the encryption/compression at work). To monitor the drive, I was using:
watch nvme smart-log /dev/nvme0
A review of a 4TB Sabrent Rocket 4 Plus shows it thermal throttling at a slightly lower 73C so you should expect to see some thermal throttling by the drive if you’re going to be running full tilt for more than a few minutes.
That’s mean NVME SSD with high capacity in most cases work on 70+ temperatures even with heatsink?
Depends on how good your heat sink is I guess. I see a lot of PCIe 5.0 SSDs will need active cooling solutions.
TjMax for Micron’s commercial NAND looks like it’s 85C atm: https://www.micron.com/-/media/client/global/documents/products/technical-note/dram/tn0008_thermal_apps.pdf
The read/write speed throttling…I wonder if that’s due to the NAND’s or the controller’s temperature.