+1 on the making the case available separately. I was on the lookout for micro itx cases. Now I think I’ll just wait to get the framework one.
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A bit confusing product as others also are saying.
Any information about power consumption while idle?
I miss a comprehensible excuse in this text, as to why it was impossible to make use of the new LPCAMM2 standard here.
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I actually think this is a solid product for certain niches.
Their focus on AI or more specifically on LLMs in yesterday’s presentation was kind of meh, but there’s a lot of things that can be done with machine learning aside from LLMs and this machine seems like an affordable way to train models with higher memory requirements than your average “affordable” graphics card provides.
I can also see a device like this used as a SteamOS box for a TV setup (although certainly pretty expensive for that use case). Or just a relatively high-performance, small and efficient desktop PC.
The biggest downside is the soldered memory.
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As far as I know, all the strix halo benchmarks so far are from the Asus Z13, which has a ~70W TDP and what I understand subpar memory settings (eg latency) that can’t be changed. The FW desktop @120-140W TDP will perform quite a bit differently.
But yeah, 1440P Ultra or 4K without FSR/frame gen might be pushing it. But if FSR4 actually will support it, and AFMF 2.1 is even just a little bit better than 2.0, why not use them?
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In the event they mentioned that effective BW would be halved, maybe due to latency?
So far I haven’t seen anyone do dual LPCAMM2 slots, which would be needed for the 256 bit memory bus. Also LPCAMM2’s are basically not available, but that’s a secondary argument.
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THANK YOU. This was point 1 I wanted to know about.
Next thing: anyone know if it’ll be possible to fit FW13/16 boards into this with an adapter plate or something? Would be really neat to put a FW13 board in this desktop case when I upgrade the FW13 board.
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Asrock’s Deskminis are mini-STX. Not the same form factor. If you want to use one of those boards, it’d have to be a DIY job.
I think this release is geared towards institutional markets. FW12 has a good chance with academic spheres, and the desktop is for AI devs that see the value in the product offering.
That said, the desktop market is already modular. You can just buy the FW desktop case and put in whatever mini-itx motherboard/cpu combo you want.
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I am thinking from the perspective of somebody that does DIY and repair: They have completely dropped the ball.
Framework 13 is great, but it had a lot of issues. Instead of perfecting their design, they are going after other markets.
I bought an Asus laptop last time, and I was telling myself to buy Framework on my next one. Now… I probably will be buying Asus again, which is a shame.
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I was basing my points of the FPS that AMD gave in the reveal, I thought they were directly from the framework desktop, but they could be results seen elsewhere as an example?
I’d like to see what it can do on bazzite, and if it can do High/ultra 1440p at 60fps, then its a lot more appealing to me.
However, I will wait for some actual videos from people, be it reviewers, those who got a preview of the desktop, or the Bazzite development team, before I seriously consider a purchase
I’m using my framework 16 as a desktop at the moment, and it does struggle with Final Fantasy VII Rebirth, at least on Linux, and it makes an awfully loud noise, so I’m at the point where I’m waiting to see if Valve announces any PC hardware, then picking between the FrameWork Deskotp, and the Valve option.
In an ideal world, I’d get both, the FrameWork Desktop could be used for AI, Rendering, Work, a home server, etc, and then the Steam Machine, just use it as a console, but I don’t think my bank would let me have that kind of overdraft.
Strix Halo is designed for laptops, which don’t have a need for as many PCIe lanes as desktops.
Strix Halo only has 16 PCIe lanes total (with a total of 252 Gbps bandwidth), and likely has further restrictions on how those can be combined and split (so it may not be able to support x16 even if you were okay with using all lanes).
By contrast Granite Ridge (Ryzen 9000 desktop) has 28 PCIe lanes (with total bandwidth 882 Gbps).
They could potentially have introduced a PCIe switch to share the bandwidth of some PCIe lanes (maybe one of the SSDs could’ve been setup to share with the Wi-Fi and possibly ethernet in order to free up some lanes for the slot to be x8), however that adds cost and complexity (and unlike with Granite Ridge there isn’t a ready made solution for that with reference designs and stuff).
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I also think that the comparison is not completely fair. A DDR5-6800 128gb kit (four DIMMs) for example costs like 980€ here. The price pulls super tight the higher the speeds go.
We’re talking LPDDR5-8000 or even 8500 here. This price is absolutely fine.
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Can’t wait for this level of hardware to arrive in the Framework Laptop 16 Gen2!
Whether it be these AI MAX+ HX APUs or Medusa Point/Halo or Morpheus Point/Halo 
You need to understand the use of transmission lines in electrical theory, and how the stubs that the connectors form cause signal reflections that limit the speed of the data bus. By soldering the RAM onto the PCB these stubs get almost eliminated and so the reflections that cause signal rining disappear.
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Don’t forget that the units with less RAM also have a lower number of CPU/GPU cores, so that will also factor into the price difference, probably more so than the different RAM chips.
What?
No.
Ew.
Did AMD only give you these chips on condition you market the machine for AI? It’s disgusting.
I don’t even wanna talk about the technical stuff like soldered RAM, no PCIe expansion, or 3D graphics performance. Just the focus on “this is your AI PC” makes me sick to my stomach, and never want to touch one of these, even if I were to need a LAN party PC.
I’m severely disappointed in Framework and I’ll be reconsidering whether buying the laptops is a good choice either.
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Yes. Considering that it has a PCIe slot, it would not do to talk about this because it is a lie. 
Sure, heavily limited PCIe expansion, whatever. Let’s nitpick smugly and ignore the core point.
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For my purposes as a scientist, a box is the best solution. To that I attach the keyboard I need, and most importantly, a large high-resolution screen. Large calculations, and graphical representations instead of gaming is what I prioritize. Unfortunately, the scientific use of PC’s are constantly neglected in favour of gaming and these day, AI applications, by all producers on the market. In this case I ask myself if this processor is right for me, and if this box will stay stable and technically problem free.
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