Just finished lapping the heatsink of the Framework laptop, and it seems like there’s a problem / issue with it from the factory, at least on my particular heatsink.
While lapping the heatsink, it became clear that the contact plate is dished / not flat. This created a poor contact point for 1 of the 4 cores, causing this particular core (physical core) to heat up before the other 3…subsequently causing thermal throttling to kick in.
After lapping (still not completely flat yet…that dish is deep, about 2/10 of a mm it seems), the processor can momentarily reach 59.1W peak for a split second.
Background, I used the Shapton Glass Stone (just a whetstone really) for 1000, 2000, 6000 and 10000 grits.
The area in red is the potential performance lost due to thermal throttling.
The processor doesn’t reach 60w (my unit, 11th gen), and the wattage will continue to drop as the processor is trying to maintain the temperature to under 100c. The duration of the PL2 is 28secs, then PL1 kicks in…dropping to 28w, sustained.
The most ideal / capable laptops would have the red area in blue, full 60w for the entire duration of tau. But that’s not the Framework laptop.
The fan speed profile doesn’t seem to change in Windows between the different Power Modes. Ideally, if the fan spin-up can be more responsive / aggressive in “Best performance” mode, that could change the slope gradient of the thermal throttling period…to something a bit flatter.
Correctly and incorrectly. The major version of the product as reported through all of the version-related APIs (as far down as RtlGetVersion) is 10. The marketing version is not reported through any APIs.
That is good to see, I’m having difficulty achieving that on 11th gen i5-1135G7. Where you in a walk in freezer by chance?
I cannot get above ~40W with Cinebench R23 / cpu benchmarks and only ~50W with prime95.
The limit is always indicated as thermal but even at the start of R23 (when there is thermal headroom) the power never seems to target above the low 40s.
This is a thin and light laptop, I’m not expecting a desktops performance profile but I do expect it to be able to hit the 60W boost it states it can do.
If anyone has the equipment…maybe test out how flat the contact plate is of the CPU heatsink. Something like what’s done here:
Mounting pressure on laptops can’t (typically) be as high as that of desktops, so to get the best thermal transfer of any contact made, flatness is even more of a key factor in laptops. Ideally, as flat and as polished as the die.
but basically - SO WHAT? You have new spec, while We can’t buy ANY spec still in Poland. Sorry, but I was expecting to be able to at least prorder late 2021. We are in mid 2022, you have NEW GEAR and still nothing in Poland, new nor old. I really need to replace my t420 thinkpad, and if there is nothing till next month I’m just going to bite the bullet and go with apple m1 macbook. Sorry.
Unfortunately (or fortunately, depending on how you view the matter), you trying to say “I won’t buy this product if it’s not available next month!” won’t magically make Framework go “oh okay here you go it’s available in Poland now.”
This kind of stuff takes time, money, cooperation with shipping services, planning, and many other things. Framework doesn’t have the same capabilities as Dell, Apple, Lenovo, HP, or other companies. They need time to do things, and Framework can’t take risks.
Well ok, or you could just write “Come on buddy you can make it. Just wait a little longer, give a little more patience, they are doing the best they can”
Many do not want or need auto-update bloatware loaded on their system
To throw myself into a month-old discussion: IMO most of these other points are beyond-nitpicky, the build quality on the framework is great for it’s price range. I understand from your previous comments that your machine is super-kitted out - which bumps you up a few laptop price-range brackets - but for most the framework cost about ~$1k. The only point I’d really give you is #2 about the speakers, which don’t really rattle the chassis on my machine but they aren’t amazing. Any of the other points either do not apply to my machine, or they are complete non-issues unless I one day decide to attack my laptop with precision calipers.
As for “who the upgrades are for”, this is how I see it: there is absolutely no need to upgrade from 11th to 12th gen. It makes sense that framework is offering 12th gen, so they may as well also offer the upgrade option. You need these kits available anyways in case someone needs a replacement mainboard. However, in a few years when there are multiple generations of hardware improvements, it might make sense for more people to upgrade their mainboard from 11th to (?)th-gen Intel or AMD.
Anyone who is going to upgrade their mainboard every year is in the 5% who can burn that kind of money. Most of those boards are going in a landfill - and while that’s better than a whole machine going in the landfill - it’s still quite a waste unless you can find something cool to do with the old board.
Nitpicking, has a somewhat overlap with presentation, attention to details and perceived quality (not always functional benefit, or has diminishing benefit return). It’s all around us, particularly in the premium / luxury market. “Nitpicking” is not exclusive to those markets / products. The degree of attention paid to the overall product during design, manufacturing, packaging, shipping, delivery…everything step along the way, has a price, and has a perception value associated to the product as a whole.
Examples:
Stitching uniformity:
Presentation, what’s the nutrition value there…not much. But it’s a perceived quality thing:
Check out this channel for real examples of quality, attention to detail, repurpose, remade:
It’s about having the ‘option’ of not having to check the forum / find the discussion thread. Just like right to repair is also about having options.
Man it’s been what, 9-10 months since I first caught wind of the framework laptop, hundreds of updates and blog posts, a new generation model and I still after all this time cannot get my hands on one. Might as well just buy something else at this point
@Aurelio Using a Framework Symbol is a great idea! Even if it just said “SUPER” or a Superman S logo instead of the lame Windows icon would be a huge improvement.
@anon81945988 Yes I understand that is why. I find it gross to have to have a branded Windows logo when I am using Linux. Most OEMs saying yes to having a Windows logo on their keyboard is part of the reason why I choose to not support those businesses with my money.
