Think we’ve reached a common ground then. Those vPro use cases will need to be scoped out. Does that mean the Framework isn’t quite ready for enterprise yet? (Yes, there are, of course, many other factors beyond costs alone)
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Definitely, its kinda a given from what I understand that on-site repairs be offered for enterprise use. Dell, HP, all the big names offer this AND volume discounts on products. You aren’t seeing the volume discounts enterprise customers would receive nor is Framework offering that kind of support they need to in order to compete in that space.
Framework needs to scale up to compete there as I would argue that their product squarely takes aim at the XPS 13 and 15 and that market segment.
Also B2B is where the money is.
Edit: It’s odd but I’m not certain how much IT departments will be interested in doing hardware modifications, I imagine that instead of replacing boards, they would order entire new laptops. Not sure if Framework would buy back the old ones at a discount or what…certainly they could buy them back at a discount from when they were sold and then re-sell them again on the marketplace as refurbs, thus doubling the income from the same product
Hmm…actually this sounds like a great idea, who doesn’t want to sell the same product twice at a profit each time?
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Just ordered mine and am in Batch 2! I’m super excited.
The only downside of the upgrade is that mine won’t ship until August! Ah well, it’s worth the wait, I suppose.
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If money is criteria you are partially correct, but then you have chosen to leave
whereas others are likely to find a use for it or sell it.
So the price difference is unlikely to be as you lay it out.
Is keeping up with the Jones’ that important anyway. If such specs were as issue 10 months ago I’m sure those few people who couldn’t do without would wait, and if they couldn’t then either they have money to throw around or the bought into the Framework world and are not bothered with the latest update.
…that’s the insanity: Shell out more money and time to purchase additional parts to make use of the mainboard & lid. Or sell the parts at what likely will be a substantially cost…if there’s a buyer (and no warranty for the buyer), and left with one useful system. Lucky if would even get $600 from that.
It’s as laid out, just didn’t list out all the permutations :
- Pay $1500 (plus tax) and have two fully usable systems.
- Pay $1480 (plus tax) and have one usable system and a mainboard & lid on the bench
- Pay $1480 (plus tax) and have one usable system, sell the part. Say, I get $600 back. → Pay $880 (plus tax) and have one usable system.
So, between 1 and 3:
$1500 for two functional systems (one faster, one slower), or $880 to only have one faster system.
Yeap! that’s why I’ll be sticking to my 1165 for a very long time 
I don’t need an upgrade and definitely don’t want the hassle of getting rids of bits and pieces.
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Which brings the question: Great…we can upgrade…but who is it really for / targeting?
I think it’s just an offer, it’s not for any one, after all the upgraded parts are going to happen for the new model, so why not offer them to the few who
- want the latest and have no concern about finances
- for hands on geeks that can put the old stuff to ‘good’ use
- those people who have damaged their existing boards or lids etc.
Not really a question is it, I mean who cares
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I have no more question.
Those would pick any best laptop at the time…and not be stuck to a platform.
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I’m kind of shocked we haven’t had any videos of the new design at announcement.
?? What’s to see.
Outwardly it will look the same inwardly the motherboard will look the same.
In use, unless you are a game player I can’t imagine that there would be much to see on the graphics side.
What are you hoping to see?
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Principles of construction, design and testing of the newly redesigned lid vs the first generation.
Official video guides for screen, speaker replacement, etc.
Any difference in chassis construction from the vPro WiFi models vs the newly integrated WiFi?
Design and difference between the new hinge replacement vs the first generation hinge along with a best practice for doing a replacement or hinge upgrade/swap.
Best practice(s) and tips for new motherboard replacement.
Wouldn’t mind seeing the engineering team walk through the reasoning and philosophy why they made the decisions on the first generation product vs the new models.
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There are official guides available, not video ones but good ones at Framework Laptop 13 - Framework Guides
Where an ESD strap and keep track of your screws. Framework makes these things very easy, it’s not very hard even for someone who has never done this before. I would trust my fiancee to do this and she is very much not tech-savvy.
What do you mean “integrated”? They’ve been installing the models for users for months now. The only difference is the support for vPro, there is no physical difference between WiFi modules.
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I would rather they work on getting the idle battery use down and also we need an easy way to configure the max TDP down to like 15W or something without the performance becoming terrible.
AMD has a much better performance per watt than Intel particularly when running in high performance mode:
Suggesting that Intel is even competitive in power use to performance is a joke if you actually look at the numbers. Yes it performs really nicely, but uses a lot more power when doing so.
I have a desktop for when I want to be plugged into a wall. For me, battery life on a laptop is more important than pure performance. If it’s plugged in, sure, boost the performance to 11. But on battery I would want to see power efficiency and lower max TDP, bigger battery.
I want something more like a repairable MacBook with Linux/Windows support, not a repairable Alienware. I will try to get something to work on that.
This is why I really want to switch to an AMD mainboard. I can use the Framework for like 2-3 hours at most (given that I usually have moderate load on the CPU/GPU from the apps I use) and then I have to find an outlet or switch to my MacBook, which can last an entire 8-hour day even when running applications. But I need Linux for development and Windows for gaming, so even if I use the Mac for everything possible, saving the Framework battery as much as possible, I still often end up forced to plug it into a power outlet due to not being able to do everything I need to do on a Mac. Having an AMD processor instead of Intel could solve this issue.
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Have there been any power usage improvements for expansion cards? It’d be nice to be able to use the cards I bought without worrying about how much battery life I lose when them.
Framework said there were power usage improvements but no specifics were given
If you look at this topic here: Price Difference between the 3 Processor Options
You’ll see that I was more than a little critical of Framework’s pricing policies as well. I was VERY afraid that they could decide to emulate the same BS that Apple does with their insane price gouging.
Now, it is more clear to me that exactly because they don’t have such a big lineup (yet) they really need to practice steeper prices in what they consider their “top category”.
You will certainly find more attractive prices on the market elsewhere (always). I recently bought an i7-1165G7 Swift 3 for $685 ($895 less than the price I would have paid for a similar Framework at that time). But good luck to her trying to find a replacement screen around here if she accidentally cracks it… Good luck replacing the (horrible) trackpad if it stops working… It won’t be hard to replace the battery in a few years, but it will cost much more than Framework’s… And so on…
It helps if we don’t focus so much on pricing right now, specially because Framework has given us plenty of indication that it IS a fair company (just look at most prices at the marketplace, starting with the easiest ones to compare: memory and storage - all pretty reasonable).
Another thing that helps to have in mind is that dreadful fact that most companies (including Intel, etc - not only Framework) like to punish what they call “early adopters”; meaning: “if you want the best and you want it right now, you’ll have to pay for the privilege”.
In a few (or many, depending on the point of view) months we will all be able to have those upgrades at more reasonable prices. What IS more IMPORTANT is that they kept their promise and an upgrade IS possible; in a year, 2 years, 5 years… it will STILL be possible (and that’s pretty awesome and quite unique).
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So really, the time to value (return / ROI) is not now…no point in buying into the platform now then…when the ‘upgrade’ while technically possible, doesn’t actually translate to actual benefit as you have to “pay for the privilege”… And it’s not clear when that “in x years” will be. “Lease on the way to the landfill” likely still comes out ahead…dollar-wise, as long as you don’t need to repair. Just buy annually, and sell the old unit.
This ‘upgrade-ability’ sounds more like a niche marketing than actual benefit for the mass consumers at this point in time.
Then Framework will die. Yeah there is an early adopter tax to some extent but then, how else is Framework going to generate the revenue to scale up? Note that Batch systems are still in place for 12th gen. This is indicative that they need the cash from the first batch to pay for the manufacturing of the second.
Only because there isn’t a proven track record. At this point in time, I am still buying into an ecosystem that may or may not survive. If it works then like the AM4 platform for AMD, early adopters will reap the benefits for a number of years.
You pay for quality 
its the same thing for any other device or appliance. The cheap stuff is manufactured to reach a certain price point at any cost, including cost to durability. I don’t think the tax is too extreme, its not like Apple tax levels.
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Is there an estimate for shipping to Switzerland? There seems to be no timeframe public, and with this update I prefer it even more over any other laptop…