You make me realise that there is a use for flight mode even when not flying. But my thrust I think was this: it is too easy to press that button accidentally.
Elsewhere within this thread, MJ1 countered that last claim by saying the following. It is not too much to expect the user to attend to what she types. But then MJ1 noted (in effect) that it is easy to lose track of whether function lock is on.
Still: one can set the machine to boot with function-lock on (or I presume one can); that is the work-around that I propose to use.
I think that my work around will be to set function-lock to be on
I think an ideal for future hardware revisions would be to mimic the same style of switch used for the webcam/microphone kill switches. Those switches are difficult to toggle accidentally, and they have a visual indication of whether they are on or off. I agree that having it on the keyboard is making it too easy to accidentally toggle (though, as others have mentioned, it is VERY common to have it on the keyboard on laptops, so this definitely isn’t a framework-specific concern).
Isn’t the default that the “Fn” key is locked ‘On’ by default? And there should be a way to turn it off so “F” key secondary functions only work when you press the “Fn” button then press the corresponding “F” key combo? Or am I not on the same wavelength as the OP?
In my 6 months or so of having the Framework16, I have only pressed that accidentally one time. As others have said, this has been a standard feature on laptops for a pretty long time now.
You may not be used to the recent trend of making the alternate function of the F-keys the default. To that I say, just turn it off so it is like your previous laptops (press fn+f-key for alternate functions) if that’s what you are used to.
Yes it can be disabled. OP might not be aware of this.
On older ThinkPads, there were two mechanisms for toggling flight mode:
Physical switch on the side of the chassis, AND
Fn+F5: This needs to be enabled/configured to have the “flight mode” behaviour.
The OP’s issue (if I’m not mistaken) is specifically how ‘easy’ it is to toggle flight mode with a key press of a ‘single key’. I agree it’s an issue if the keyboard is in media key mode (what’s the proper term for it?) instead of F-key mode. For this reason, I Fn-Lock my keyboard, so F10 is F10.
Going back to Point 2 (above). ThinkPad’s implementation was that it gives you a user-configuration of “toggle wifi” or “prompt” for action. The Prompt (below) will give you a choice of toggle wifi, and toggle bluetooth.
Here’s a screenshot of that configuration:
On FL13, it’s the lack of user configuration that’s impacting user experience.
For ThinkPads and some Latitudes (IIRC), this UX implementation is history, been there, done that. Framework just isn’t there with the EC, nor the software yet…and didn’t learn from the trailblazers that went before. Still waiting for those quality of life improvements from Framework.
And then, on the Dell Rugged Latitudes (e.g. Rugged Extreme), their flight mode is not just wifi off, bluetooth off, but also LEDs off, keyboard backlight off, display panel off. It’s “stealth” mode.
…and so, I’ve been asking if we’re going to get an Fn-Lock LED indicator on the keyboard…so we can know for sure if I press on F10…do I get F10…or Flight mode toggle. But that request has been ignored …I don’t even know where that is…maybe a v2 keyboard we have yet to hear about?
I’m not saying that we should copy the idea from 15+ years ago and copy it. I’m saying there’s a lesson to be learnt…1. User-configurable, and, 2. Not a single-key.
I’ve already seen a lot of possible workarounds (including making changes to the EC firmware) and none of them are a real fix.
The same is true for the link you’re mentioning. I’ve already switched the FN lock and, guess what, my cat is still able to enable airplane mode accidentally.
If there’s a better place to phrase my concern about it, I wasn’t able to find it and happily accept any redirect
I’m in the IT dept. Lots and lots of my end users called me for help over the years, only to find out that they had accidentally toggled airplane mode. I’m happier now that fewer laptops have hardware airplane mode switches or key combos.
It is also common to get calls where they had disabled the microphone or webcam via hardware privacy switches or shutters. Ugh.
I’m one who would demand the complete removal of any airplane mode key on the keyboard (I wouldn’t even want to have them change it to a key combo). It’s easy enough to use the OS to disable the wifi and bluetooth. Best part for me is that I can see, diagnose, and correct disabled wifi and bluetooth in the OS via remote support software, but I can’t easily deal with hardware or BIOS-based switches. In those cases, I have to talk the end user through it on the phone.
You’d be surprised–I’m in IT and I get at least two calls a year from an end user who accidentally hit the webcam/microphone privacy switch.
Usually it ends up being a huge kerfuffle too. They often discover their mistake when in “the most important Zoom meeting of the year!” and of course panic hard and call me frantically while the other Zoom participants wait impatiently. I think the social pressure of being put on the spot turns off their brains such that they can’t simply look up and see the indicator that the privacy switch is engaged.
I get why mfgs put the hardware privacy switches in, but it is really hard for us IT techs to talk the end users through diagnosing the issue when they’re panicking. If it’s software-only, what I can do is quickly remote into their machine and fix it for them, then verify everything’s working with the Zoom meeting. The end user feels better (since they can just sit back and leave it entirely up to us techs) and I get it fixed faster. I’d ban all hardware cut-off switches if I could, at least on our corporate computers.
So… I just need to let my cat know, that it’s her fault for pressing this button…
Seriously, it’s not about the existence of this button, it’s about making it configurable in a way, that it can be turned off. Like a lot of other manufacturers are doing it.
Besides that, this button is working, even if the laptop is locked. I wouldn’t have any issues, if this wouldn’t be the case, as I’m locking my laptop everytime I’m leaving it, because of my cats.
In that case, the proper place would be in EC firmware: add a BIOS option to disable airplane key entirely OR add a key-combo to prevent its accidental pressing, such as Ctrl-Airplane or Ctrl-Alt-Airplane (assuming F row is toggled so that key is not F10 at the time).
Somehow, though, I bet your cats would still manage to press Ctrl AND Airplane at the same time, so a complete disable option is probably better.
No. This is the appropriate thread to add yet another request for QMK on the FW13 because it shows yet another good reason to do it.
If I go add my voice to those other threads, it will be drowned out.
This Airplane key issue is a very legitimate reason to allow customization of the FW13 keyboard. It doesn’t even have to be QMK. It could be some other configurator.
The Airplane key issue is one reason I am not buying FW13s or recommending them as fleet laptops, even though they would make great fleet laptops due to parts interchangeability. The last thing I need is to increase the number of end user calls desperately wondering why they have no network access.
