I would like to note that if a “FW16 Gen2” ever comes along within the coming 2 years it seems reasonable to speculate that a 6% bump to the default battery capacity from 85Wh to 90Wh to better power a 12-core “Strix Point” APU that performs like a Ryzen 9 7845HX + GTX 1660 plugged-in and like a Ryzen 5 3600X/7535U + GTX 1060 on battery at 54W sustained. I do wonder if Framework can source or engineer a stock cooling solution that cools that 9 extra watts.
If we can achieve a 45Wh battery capacity expansion (135Wh total) then gaming or running workstation workloads for 2 to 2.5 hours nonstop off the wall seems like it could very well be a reality. A stretch goal of 162Wh would mean 3 whole hours unplugged at 54W or over 20 hours unplugged at 8W.
And from what I’m gathering we’re trying to see if either 3-5 x 18650s (33-55Wh with each Samsung 35E cell being 11Wh of capacity discharging at 5A) or 17.76Wh (great if this gets realized on Independence Day this year or next year) worth of 4 x Li-Po cells.
But that then begs this question in my head: could maximizing the battery capacity in an expansion module comprise of both Li-Po AND 18650 cells? Cuz then the total capacity would be 17.76+33Wh (50.76Wh) or 17.76+44Wh (61.76Wh) or 17.76+55Wh (72.76Wh) instead of the limits of either cell type we can fit into the expansion bay alone.
P.S. 7 years from now we’ll almost definitely see the first waves of non-flammable mass market solid state batteries so having laptops with 200Wh or even 300Wh batteries without being any larger in volume will be beyond awesome. In the meantime I wouldn’t mind carrying a 90Wh FW16 laptop in my backpack while chucking a 45Wh Battery Add-on Module (B.A.M.) into my carry-on.
Instead of using the expansion bay, maybe one can use an external battery with USB-C PD and just plug it into the USB-C port on the FW charging port.
That is what I use for my mobile phone currently, but it would work just as well for a laptop as it would a mobile phone.
Is the expansion bay wired such that it can hold a battery. I.e. are their actually wires from the expansion bay to power the laptop ?
I think the wires only cover power from laptop to expansion bay, and not the other way round.
You’re right, why not both!? 55Wh would be sweet. There are a lot of restrictions based on my design, to say the least. If I’m still going to push with my design (I haven’t touched it since the last post due to school), I’ll have to 3d print frames to accommodate it; I might as well add some more room in the process and redesign the frame to accommodate a lot more capacity.
That seems low, is that enough draw for the cpu, monitor, usb, etc etc? The 180W not being enough for the laptop with the gpu that tops out at 100w draw makes me think that might be cutting it close if you are wanting to do anything that might push it with the battery module
The CPU will draw power in the mid 50w range temporarily and then STAPM throttle (ie. Reduce power to keep the temperature of the outside of the laptop safe to touch) to 45w soon after.
I haven’t seen the datasheet for the display that Framework is using (afaik it hasn’t been released publicly), however it is a variant of a panel where the other variants are all around 6w to 9w at full brightness.
The keyboard and other parts of the laptop are no more than a couple watts.
So unless the user is plugging high powered USB devices into every single port (each individual port is limited to 7.5w, although one port at a time can bump to 15w with PD), 90w should be plenty. If someone is doing that they may just have to draw some power from the main battery.
The laptop without the gpu has gotta be capable of pulling at LEAST > 80W or the 180W adaptor would be enough even with gpu as its only capable of pulling 100W sustained, so at the very least that 90s gotta be cutting it close, and the ones i have seen where people are pulling from battery are only using usb mouse nothing else
I managed to pull 90W from the wall with mine under synthetic loads.
No dGPU, but I got the 180W adapter.
The CPU reports 45W, so the other 45W must be used for other things. The fans combine to 12W, don’t know how the rest figures into it.
The 180w adapter operates at 36v, which is a higher voltage than the laptop itself operates at (20v according to the documentation on GitHub), creating a need to convert that 180w down to a lower voltage.
In an attempt to justify continuing to use proprietary plugs another brand (Asus) has claimed that dealing with that higher voltage wastes ~10% of the power from the charger. Which if taken at face value means that after that inefficiency the laptop only gets ~162w from the 180w charger.
So with the GPU taking 100w that means that the rest of the laptop is capable of drawing over 62w when under heavy sustained load. 90w is probably cutting it close but I don’t doubt it will be adequate most of the time (and when it isn’t I don’t think it’s a big deal to tap in to the main battery briefly, or just limit the CPU power, at 30w the CPU is only slightly lower performing than at the full 45w).
Lastly I have a Framework Laptop 16 without dGPU and the most I’ve gotten it to draw from the battery has been around 70w (with Windows set to max performance and running a render with the screen at 100% brightness).
Hello to all contributers of this thread,
first I would like to thank you all for posting here.
But I think there is some confusion or misconception about this thread.
First to the target of this thread:
→ A Battery EXTENSION that is connected to the FW16 with the Expansion Bay
And for clarification:
→ There is no room for a dGPU anymore
→ The internal and the extension battery would work together (providing more than 90W in total)
To see waht is THEORATICALY possible please refer to my post above:
If you just want to extend the runtime of your FW on the go and are happy with an external weight and cable then just use a PD Powerbank from a reputable brand.
And for my final thing to say: PLEASE for all of you that want to contribute to this or any other thread. Don’t jump in there and write stuff before even reading the (whole) thread. We want good and helpfull posts and are not willing to clarify misconceptions every time.
I dont think anyone thought there was room for the dgpu still, I used it as a point to measure possible power draw under load without dgpu. This also reads as accusatory towards my comment particularly, so in defense, I have read the entire thread, have been here since it first started. If that was just premptive I apologize, thats just how it comes off with its timing and the rest of its wording relative to obviously misunderstanding my reason for mentioning dgpu.
Hmm, I dont know, I can see the logic for both choices. Doing so could increase feedback from makers, but could also cause confusion, especially if a mod merged the topics, at least initially.
Soo I have found a huge issue with my current design. It won’t fit. Not even close to possible.
The rails for the back module use the same rails as the battery housing; it really is on me for not looking; I was wondering at the time why there was a conveniently placed groove at the sides. Basically, I’m going to have to do a complete redesign; I’m curious to see if I can make a larger cavity in the bay itself instead of retrofitting a battery pack into the base one. we’ll see, I need to finish up school before I start on anything. To see this better I would recommend going to the Graphics module install guide.
