At a crossroads with Framework: Keep or Yeet?

Framework Laptop 13
1

Hey everyone, looking to pick everyone’s brains and get some advice or points of view.
I’m debating whether to stick with my Framework 13 or get rid of it, after a little over a year of ownership.

I’ve also already contacted support regarding the issues I’ll be listing down below.

Use Case and Specs

90% of my use of the laptop consists of the following:

  • UI Editing Software (Figma)
  • Vector Drawing (Affinity Designer)
  • Slack
  • 10-ish Firefox Tabs
  • YouTube music running as a Brave-based PWA

And just for good measure, here are my specs and what I use the laptop with:

  • 12th Gen Intel i5-1240P
  • Crucial P3 Plus 500 GB Gen 4 SSD
  • Crucial RAM 32 GB (2 x 16 GB) DDR4 3200 MHz CL22
  • Windows 11 Pro
  • Anker USB-C 4-in-1 Charging Station
  • When I’m on the go, I use a UGreen 65W charger.
  • UGreen USB-C Hub 5-in-1 20955
  • Asus ProArt 2k 27 inch monitor

I don’t think I have a crazy intense/specific use case. But that’s the worst part, even with the modest high-mid tier specs, I run into a lot of day-to-day issues.

The Issues

Let me prephase this by saying I fair troubleshooting skills. Edit registries, repaste a CPU, follow instructions when PowerShell or a Console window is involved, etc. I don’t shy away from researching on Google, forums, Reddit posts, etc. For all the issues I’m about to list, I have tried something.

On top of that, I also understand that most of my issues come from Windows being Windows, and 12th Gen chips not being the greatest in general. Neither are issues that Framework themselves have a lot of agency over, and I understand that. My issues fall in two categories:

Power Management & Battery Life Issues

  • Biggest one is sleep mode straight up not working. This is more than well documented on the Framework forums, and even after following every solution I’ve found (powercfg, enabling and disabling certain services, etc) to this day if I leave my laptop asleep, there’s no warranty I won’t wake up to a hot laptop with a drained battery. Either that, or if I’m at home and my computer is just on my desk, asleep, without me using it, the fans fire up for no reason and it starts going with the screen still off. I compare this to my Windows desktop computer (Ryzen based, so it maybe is that) that always goes to sleep without an issue.

  • Laptop discharging while plugged in. This one baffles me. I’ve never been able to fix it consistently. From time to time, battery will start draining even though I’m working with the charger plugged in. I’ve tried a 100W charger and a 65W chargers, different cables, different ports on the Framework, and the issue pops up even then.

  • USB-C Power negotiation loops. As per listed on my specs, I use two different multiport chargers. They’re nice and practical, and from UGreen and Anker, both well established brands. The problem is that only the Framework has this weird issue where it sometimes forces the power negotiation to happen over and over again when I have say my phone and the laptop connected and the same time. This results in neither actually charging and me feeling like I’m destroying the longevity of both batteries. I’ve checked the power budgets for the different connection combinations (like how using 2 plugs can reduce each port’s wattage) and only use combinations that satisfy Framework’s 65W requirement.

Other Issues

  • The trackpad will sometimes not register nor click. I’ve tried the fix where you press the center and it doesn’t fix it.
  • Ambient Light sensor compensation is all over the place. I’ve opted for inserting a thin paper cutout to block the sensor and have a consistent brightness.
  • Fan noise is very annoying.

Conclusion

To me, it seems like the only way out of these issues might be to just stop using these third party chargers, and just get a new one straight from Framework, together with upgrading to a Ryzen board. The thing is, it's a costly fix I'd rather avoid if possible and the crux of my issue.

At that price bracket, it feels as if the better solution here is to sell the Framework itself and just get a different laptop. I don’t know if being annoyed by these issues is clouding my judgment of them.

If y’all were in this situation, what would you do?

2

For this, I just disabled the automatic brightness control in Windows & Linux:

2024-03-05 09_32_12-Settings
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I want to provide comments or tips to so many things you’ve listed as I have endured nearly everything you have described either on my ThinkPads or my Framework 13 AMD at one point.

Some of these may be valid Framework-based hardware or software issues however I also suspect a good chunk of the issues could still persist even if you switch to a Dell/HP/Lenovo etc laptop. I feel that all laptops in general have become worse at being docked/used as a desktop than they were in the past.

4

I’ve never used a first party Framework charger, but instead use a single port 65W Anker Nano II. Never had an issue charging the laptop. I’ve always been a little wary of multiport chargers though.

5

The sleep issue is a sleep state one. LTT did a 20+ minute video at one point. And apparently even MacBooks sometimes have this issue.

Generally the “fix” is to always make sure to unplug the laptop while its awake. And then put it to sleep after that. So far I’ve successfully gone 3 years one multiple laptops from multiple brands (work stuff) with Windows and Linux, without the overheating dead battery issue by doing it this way.

6

Shakehand to PD charger over and over again should be the problem on the charger.

7

There was just a (beta) firmware update that fixed some charger issues as well.

8

That’s for the amd, the intel never had that particular issue.

9

Ah, sorry, didn’t realize that.

10

So after going back and forth with Framework support, and sending them tons of photos of pretty much every part of the laptop, they’re apparently sending me a new Mainboard and a new Input Cover. Seems like these were faulty after all.

Once I get the new parts I’ll report here!

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11

I suppose you’ve got the parts by now :slight_smile: How did it go?

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12

This can be solved by using Linux

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13

I got the parts only until yesterday!

Not at all due to Framework, mind you. Support was awesome and sent me all the needed parts right away. The problem is that due to work stuff I’m currently not in the US. A friend recently visited me and was kind enough to bring the pieces with her.

Changing pieces was extremely easy, and right away all the trackpad issues were gone. However, there is a weird clearance issue with the computer and there’s a very slight gap between the new input cover and the old body. I went in to double check for any user error, but couldn’t find anything. My guess is that it’s similar to the clearance issues the FW16 is having.

As for the fan noise and heat level, I actually found out my old charger was to blame. I got one of those Anker 4-in-1 USB-C 100W PD chargers, that in and of itself was a lemon. Tested it with one of those lil current checker things, and I’m pretty sure prolonged use with that crappy charger must’ve somehow damaged the laptop. I’ve since then completely stopped using it.

That said, I haven’t done any more complete testing. During this time though and since I needed a work laptop, I wound up buying a ThinkPad T14s (Ryzen 7 7840u + 32GB of RAM) and have been using it for the last couple of months. It’s leagues ahead of the Framework in noise level and performance, though I think it’s pretty obvious that it’s because the Framework is stuck with a 12th Gen i5, and you can’t even begin to compare those two chips.

Key point here is that being where I’m currently at (México) Lenovo has actual support and presence, which let me just walk in and get it and get support and pieces shipped to where I’m staying should something happen to it. Now I understand this situation is extremely unique to me and Framework has nothing to do with it. They explicitly state that they don’t ship to México so you could say I drove myself into this corner.

My work has me stationed here for long periods of time, it sucked having it fail on me right at the start of this time frame.

I am still torn as to what to do with the laptop. A bigger, more mature brand like Lenovo or even Apple will have a generally more worldwide presence which I am now finding out works for me and I need, but I still love the Framework vision. I genuinely don’t need two laptops, so I might just sell the FW now that it’s fully repaired. If they ever expand to México, I’ll sell the ThinkPad.

14

I understand this sentiment but unfortunately Affinity Apps and Figma do not work natively on Linux. Figma works on browser, but the desktop app experience is much better only because it allows you to have tabs. Affinity I haven’t been able to get working easily.

I’m keeping an eye out for Linux though. It gets better by the day. I’m just hoping it has everything I need in my day to day one day to make the switch.

15

To me this sounds like your 13 is still using S0 Connected. This is one of the reasons. S0 is terrible. At the bare minimum S0 network disconnected should be used. Also if you machine is waking all the time, one of the default settings of Windows 11 when installing is to allow the Wifi adapter (card) to wake the machine. You want to disable this right away. (Device manager → network adapters → network card → power management tab)

If the BMS is getting too hot, it may stop charging to allow itself to cool down. One thing I would recommend, since you seem to work mostly with the laptop plugged in, is that you only partially charge your battery. (Set it to 80% in bios settings)

Power negotiation is not done exactly the same by all power bricks and portable batteries. The BMS on the Framework 13/16 has had a lot of effort put into it, so that it would be compatible with a lot of different charging voltages. Just remember the more power supplied to charge the more heat that will be created. This heat is a part of your system’s overall heat as well and requires the system fan to turn on more. Charging at a lower voltage is better for the battery and produces less heat.

Using the Framework supplied charger is recommend if you are stationary anyway.

Disable automatic brightness control. I NEVER use it. With the display brightness function keys I prefer controlling it mainly. (I run with the brightness as low as is practical for battery savings.)

You can’t edit the fan curve, BUT you can throttle your CPU such that less heat is generated with the workload you are performing. I have found that just disabling turbo boosting on the CPU frequency does a great deal to lower the heat envelope.

Looking at your other issues it seems that the majority are things that can be corrected and are not directly contributed to Framework itself, but rather software settings on Windows.

I would recommend that you try to sort some of the solutions I’ve mentioned here, and let us know if they are helping in anyway. I understand your frustration and the good news is that there is hope!

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