FW16 Batch 1 Guild

Framework Laptop 16
495

Couldn’t disagree more. IMO, this is not what botched looks like – this is what preordering looks like, with a brand new manufactured hardware product, with complex supply chains and assembly processes and too much information being shared with clueless and impatient customers.

I actually don’t think Framework should respond to that post, unless they absolutely have to. Batch 1 isn’t done shipping yet. That’s all anybody outside Framework actually knows or realistically, can know in a detailed-enough way to paint a legitimately true picture, or will care about the instant Batch 1 is done shipping.

This issue is really (a) people are understandably impatient, and (b) Framework sharing a bit more information than usual gives some of those people the illusion that they have enough of a clue what’s going on to justify getting angry about their impatience.

In reality, the high-level, communicable information we’ve gotten so far doesn’t add up to a model of manufacturing that generates accurate expectations. If you understand that going in, this all looks fine and isn’t surprising or frustrating.

If you want to de-frustrate yourself, play a game of thinking about assumptions you shouldn’t be making, and about how complex manufacturing and assembly could be: multiple assembly lines running in parallel, multiple inventories running in parallel, testing processes, dozens of people doing work and then checking that work in on terminals, stocking boxes temporarily in locked areas, assigning them out to work stations, etc. Some things will happen in parallel that you might assume would happen sequentially. If Framework tried to explain all that, it’d be incoherent to a public audience, especially one that’s already bothered, but you can satisfy yourself with imagination, if you try.

I’m sympathetic to your impatience – for real – but this is invalid. If you maxed out a laptop and spent say, $5000, one month of interest at a 5% APR is about $20, which is absolutely worth it compared to Framework erring on the side of charging people early without warning. If a financial institution can’t keep track of $5000 for a month… you need a different bank.

I think your frustrated feeling comes from getting lots of information and then no information, as opposed to any other real problem.

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496

As a matter of fact, I HAVE passed alongside my feedback to the support team. I don’t see where a rule is in place that the company cannot be critiqued or criticized. If there is, show me where it is.

It shouldn’t matter if this is a pre-order or not. The indisputable facts are this product has gotten delay after delay and buyers have been gaslight by others to “trust the process”. I have seen members state that batch 2 emails going out where nothing to worry about, you’ll still get yours first from batch 1 (assuming identical configurations between a batch 2 and batch 1). Hell Framework’s own released shipping schedule state this.

Yet it happened and a batch 1 person got a giant middle finger from the company. If you don’t give a flip about the person this happened to, that’s your prerogative. At least be honest and state that instead of writing this off as if it is nothing.

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497

Please explain why that poster’s batch 1 order, which was confirmed to be IDENTICAL to the batch 2 order that shipped, has neither been charged NOR shipped yet. Going to the exact same geological region. And this is on top of all of the other delays on this product passed the timeframe batch 1 was stated to get it.

And speaking of assumptions, you make your own in this post. Which aren’t necessary when there are some indisputable facts here that anyone who isn’t a blind fanboy of the company would go “That is bullshit”.

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498

Preorders usually have a set delivery date though… The frameworks’ date keeps getting pushed back.

My take is there might not be major issues, but there is definitely disorganization of they are starting on batch 2 with so many batch 1 still waiting.

I just sent in a support ticket to see what’s up as it’s just a little worrying.

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499

I don’t recall that I mentioned anything about not criticizing the company. If I have, please point out to me where I have done so, so that I can amend my comments. Where criticism is warranted, it should be levied.

You seem to be allowing your frustration to cause you to project regarding comments. I’m waiting for my machine, I would like it to get here as soon as it can, but I’m not allowing the anticipation to turn to frustration and venting. I’ve been through this rodeo with the company before. It will work out.

I imagine that you do not have insight into Framework’s supply chain, manufacturing, or fulfillment process. I know that I don’t, so I try to be patient.

Be well, your machine will arrive soon enough.

Edit to add - thank you for escalating your concerns to Support.

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500

Please have a look at the Community Guidelines. Tensions are running high here and we don’t want to have to start deleting posts or silencing members.

It’s a Saturday of a long weekend. No one will be able to respond to your concerns for several days. Increasing the frustration level of this thread won’t serve anything except get everyone more frustrated. It won’t get a FW16 into anyone’s hands any quicker.

Criticism is valid and allowed, but there won’t be a response any time soon. No one present has any inside information or can change things right now.

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501

Hardware preorders though? I’ve preordered… media, games, and hardware. Media has a predictable timeline usually. Games tend to be basically finished by the time most companies are willing to give you a date, and even then they slip sometimes. Hardware… I don’t think I’ve ever preordered a hardware anything that’s shipped on time.

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502

Apologies, but I have to strongly disagree. Please don’t invalidate my feelings by attempting to explain it away. Not everyone is the same or experience anxiety in the same way, we are all different. Whilst anxiety has been known to make people behave less rationally, it does not invalidate that they are likely still trying their best.

Up to this past month Framework has done a stellar job at communicating, just the way the batch 1 messaging was handled unfortunately increased customer anxiety far more than it needed to.

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503

Might want to reread that post.
The ordered units are not identical.

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504

I feel the same way. The credit card that I used has a tendency to decline big “out of the blue” transactions. Once such a transaction gets declined, my card gets turned off and I have to deal with the fall out with my bank, the merchant, and anyone else that charged me while the card was disabled. Due to such past experiences, I have been waiting anxiously for the charge to hit so that any potential cascading effects can be contained and minimized.

I’m also quite annoyed that the RAM and storage that I purchased on the side after getting the initial “We’re preparing your batch” email in late January is now stuck in limbo while the return and warranty periods on it quickly fades into the past. My big fear here is that I’ll be unable to get a replacement item if the item that got sent to me back in January turns out to be defective.

Anyway, that’s my view from the not-so-cheap seats. I hope things get better in the coming days. I never imagined that this purchase would turn into a full fledged gauntlet towards the end.

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505

I probably agree with this. Sorry if I came across as dismissive. I was responding narrowly to your comments about money.

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506

Really??? I have yet to see that happen on any product where preorders have been available, not just FW laptops. I have had some model railway stuff on preorder which waited 18 months for delivery from the factory, but they have three new items announcements plus some other special items announcements and deliveries between when I ordered and when i received the delivery. I see this happening in many other products as well.

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507

And as I have pointed out elsewhere, at times the FL13 AMD was shipping four batches at the same time, with the starting times for each batch stepped by the approximately one week that they were managing at the time.

So it could get to a point where batch 4 is being announced before batch 1 has finished shipping, going by past history.

If you don’t believe me go back through the FL13 guild batch postings.

And i do wonder how ‘exactly the same’ the order from batch 2 is compared to yours.
If you have ordered an orange bezel and they ordered lavender or black that could well be the difference. I’m using the orange bezel as an example as it seems to be very popular, judging from some of the discussions. But any of the other possible options listed further up this thread (FW16 Batch 1 Guild - #492 by BigT) could also be a cause, and I haven’t seen any discussion on the forum (I’ll grant there could be private discussion we can’t see) about how identical they are between yours and the batch 2 shipping you are miffed about.

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508

I like how you have to remove the part of his post thats actually relevant to pretend they invalidated your feelings, the only thing they said was invalid was worrying about interest, because it absolutely was, sorry you missed out on less than 20 bucks of interest, but its not a valid complaint.

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509

the fraud concern was also there, which is real; i minimize how much money i have in the account i exclusively use for online purchases at any moment in time specifically because i have dealt with repeated fraud problems over the years.

the idea of putting all that money in an account that ever gets used online for an indefinite time makes me very nervous, i’d rather have a more certain idea of “when this will leave the account”.

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510

I wish Framework would implement a “charge me now” option on batches that are in the shipping phase. It would eliminate a lot of my financial anxiety as going through a 24x7 account vigil for up to 3 weeks is both mentally and emotionally exhausting. It would also be nice to have an order status page that indicated why the order hasn’t shipped yet.

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511

But when Framework speak of a shortage, a lot of people just change their mind even among the people who had everything for their order but they heard about shortage and ask for something in “stock” instead, then the item that was in stock suddently disappear creating a new shortage. And funny thing: the item that was in shortage is not anymore since there was a lot of order changes, because people dropped the item to something else … just because people are IMPATIENT !

Some people who did not changed anything could have been served first for sure !

It’s not something you can predict and framework does not have capacity yet to fill their stockage with things that are not already ordered by their client. Plus they have to follow the factory production line speed, all 3rd parties and so on. Don’t blame them !

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512

One option is to keep your money in your savings account which is inaccessible to fraud since there is no card associated with it, only moving it into your checking account when you receive your “get ready to be charged” email through the magic of online banking which is usually effective immediately, and certainly within a business day.

A standard credit card provides even more protection, as you can often dispute fraudulent charges before you’ve actually paid for them, unlike debit cards where the money is already gone, and you’re asking the bank to give it back to you.

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513

The point is, we got the “get ready to be charged” email nearly a month ago.

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514

Oh, I see. Sorry, I missed that. Yeah, that is unfortunate, and I guess the only thing to assuage anxieties of holding excessive amounts in your checking account indefinitely would be a credit card. I think PayPal or similar payment platforms could also be used nowadays effectively like a credit card with their delayed payment options instead of directly debiting an account.

Sorry you’re all still waiting though. I hope the dam breaks this coming week!

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