Intel 14th gen is now a thing, will framework join in?

Intel 14th gen mobile was launched yesterday. I’m interested if there is any appetite for a new intel framework motherboard or if everyone is now on the AMD train?

It seems like a bit of a catchup in terms of performance, especially in gpu. All else being equal I wouldn’t mind a new intel board because I think Thunderbolt is cool, but I can wait until TB5.

USB4 is almost as good, it just needs a wee bit more love in the software department XD.

TB5 or usb4 80gbit (or whatever the hell they end up calling it) should not be that far away though, or at least I hope so.

1 Like

This is key. When “almost” isn’t good enough. lol. AMD is getting there, but not quite there.

I would prefer an Intel upgrade for my 11th-gen, although I’m still not sure if I’d bother yet, especially because the GPU is not critical for my use case these days, and meteor lake will require ddr5

Probably will stick with my original board for a few more years

With the way previous boards are being supported I hope not. They need to focus and tighten up their current product support before venturing into even more new stuff that quickly gets abandoned

3 Likes

A perfect implementation of USB4 and a perfect implementation of Thunderbolt are equally good.

The main difference is that the worst USB4 implementation allowed by the USB4 specification is significantly worse than the worst Thunderbolt implementation allowed by the Thunderbolt specification.

The most significant difference between AMD’s USB4 implementation and Intel’s Thunderbolt implementation is that AMD lacks support for carrying multiple DisplayPort signals over USB-C and instead favors carrying a single higher-bandwidth DisplayPort signal that can then be split using MST to drive a multi-monitor setup. As long as the docking station supports the latter multi-monitor implementation the difference doesn’t affect the end user, however some docking stations (mainly docks targeted towards Mac users like CalDigit docks) require the multi-monitor implementation that AMD does not support.

I don’t think that the “catch-up” worth the upgrade. Should wait for the next gen.

3 Likes

Agreed. I’m perfectly happy with my 7840U for the time being.
Zero interest in the “new” 8040, either. But Zen5 upgrade would be interesting with a whole new core architecture and RDNA3.5. Supposedly, there’s some perf limiting issues in RDNA3 that I assume will be cleaned up in 3.5.

TPU thing is currently completely useless, but I assume actual use cases will start popping up, and it’ll be more meaningful by the time Zen5 chips come out.

1 Like

Got a 12th gen Intel, waiting for 15th gen Intel to land. Won’t move over to AMD mobile for a variety of reasons, and yes Thunderbolt is part of it. USB4 simply does not cut it.

Are you using the second dp channel, otherwise it’s pretty much equal t this point.

New devices are likely not using the second channel anyway since it’s main user (apple devices that don’t support mst) also stopped providing the second dp channel (The usb4 in the m1/2/3 doesn’t have the second dp channel either).

But yeah if the stuff you are using needs it then it needs it.

Good point that the M1/M2/M3 don’t support multi-DP, but what about the M2 Pro/M3 Pro/M2 Max/M3 Max?

Apple claims that the M2 Pro and M3 Pro support “Two displays up to 6K at 60Hz over Thunderbolt” and the M2 Max and M3 Max support “Three displays up to 6K at 60Hz over Thunderbolt”.

How are those supporting multiple displays over Thunderbolt? Have they implemented proper MST support (not the previous implementation that only supported mirrored displays with MST)?

Leave it to apple the have 2 different usb4 implementations in the same product line and generation. I just looked at the non pro ones and assumed they would not use different implementations, my bad there I guess.

I really don’t quite understand why amd left out the second channel, it can’t be that more expensive and would have given them almost perfect compatibility.

Not only that, but buying the newer/more expensive product often doesn’t get the better implementation.

The M3 in the 24" iMac (1299usd) has a usb4 implementation. The M2 in the Mac mini (599usd) has a Thunderbolt 4 implementation.

They actually got intel to certify a non intel usb4 chip-set?!

Here is a list of which apple products are which version of TB3/4/USB4

Edit: But of note, no Apple Silicon implementation supports eGPU’s :frowning:

If intel actually certified non intel implementations that is a pretty big step in the right direction.

For driver reasons, pcie tunneling apparently works just fine.

I read Arrow Lake (end 2024) will make use of Thunderbolt 5.
A point in time when egpu enclosures will start making way more sense.
I do think that the current expansion modules of Framework will be Thunderbolt 4 only though?
Or can we use those (usb-c modules), with Thunderbolt 5 speeds as long as the Motherboard supports it?

Was about time, hope amd doesn’t wait too long to put 80gbit usb4 into their socs too and maybe not skimp on the second dp channel this time.

Given they are dumb passthroughs they may work with tb5 too, assuming they don’t mangle the signal too much. Bi-directional 80gbit over 4 pairs of copper wire is pretty insane when you think about it.

2 Likes