That linear exhaust flow only looks correct because the bezel is off. Get your own fw13 out and you’ll notice it’s 100% meant to exhaust with lid open only because hot air rises.
You’ll notice that as the lid opens up more and more, the bottom angle closes up more and more leading to a upwards angular flow. Let me prove it to you with the last photo using full open hinge.
Shouldn’t there be a thermal throttling going on here? I believe at least the CPU would automatically throttle down. Shouldn’t the battery also?
Also there is a difference between a laptop being closed and 99% idle (a bit of email and web surfing) vs 99% in use (AI workloads, heavy gaming, etc). The latter takes a lot more power and produces a lot more heat.
Eh, not exactly. Lot of variables, but we can do a simple physics pov.
I would love to see FW do a thermal analysis on lid closed + dock set up.
So an intro physics course would say that energy in must equal energy out or there is a net build up.
Since we do not have the actual values or variables, we can only intuitively assume what the formula might look like.
Based on my image analysis, and how they engineered the product to work with the lid open to dissipate heat - we can assume there is going to be a net positive energy staying inside the system vs leaving it.
So, let’s say the system makes 50 units of heat, so why is the net result actually 40 when it’s actually closer to 25 with the lid open?
And let’s say 40 is still hot - but not enough to trigger throttling (if throttling actually exists on linux if that’s what you’re using.)
So it turns out - there is about 10 units of heat being dissipated through the aluminum chassis - a great conductor of heat.
So this might have been compensating for what would have been a battery disaster in a few months if that to an entire year.
Second big factor would be linux based: the lack of proper drivers and of the such for idle, sleep, hibernate, suspend on linux leads to consistent power drain and can lead to the battery just holding onto more heat than it should.
So it brings me back to my original question: Are you using the fw 13 with the lid closed docked?
I can see many potential issues with this if the bezel remains on for long periods of time. The aluminum can only take so much heat before it maxes out and is then reliant on the environmental gradient + air flowing over the laptop’s chasis to remove heat - which is a terrible heat solution regardless. And when the chassis maxes out - you can think of it as you having had pre-heated your oven to 350F. If it couldn’t remove heat at all - it would just keep going up and up.
This is why even though you can be doing light work - given enough time with heat not leaving the system - you can still get a well pre-heated oven going on.
Yes.
When there aren’t other forces dominating. And when the warm air is in a space where cooler air can press in on it.
You do need to consider that air is being forced out, and in, under significant pressure. This changes the dynamics. The pressure differential created by the fans far, far outweigh the buoyancy of warm air vs room temperature air. Where the air will go will be governed by the path offered to it. As long as the pressure differential is high, pressurized flow is the dominating force. Once it reaches an open space, then the buoyancy of warm air will start to outweigh the force of the air stream.
I personally dock my laptop open, with some method of providing additional space below for added airflow. At home, that’s a 3D printed stand I modified to keep the monitor height even with the bottom of my second monitor (~6 in of air below the laptop). When traveling, it’s whatever I can stick under the back “foot” of the laptop (~0.5in of air).
I have the same issue. Got my Framework last August; this summer noted issues with the touchpad and finally discovered the swollen battery. Of course, now I am past the one year threshold, but the problem already started before… I will contact support and see if they can help.
Could people reporting bulging batteries please also report how they are using the battery.
Are you often cycling it deeply, or mostly using the laptop with the charger connected, or some of each?
If you often use the laptop with the charger connected do you just let it charge to 100% or do you limit charging to 80%, 70% or whatever in the BIOS?
Thanks.
From the earlier cases that do have this information, it’s pretty clear that it’s not user wear related and is in fact abnormal battery performance. There doesn’t seem to be a specific wear pattern that causes this.
If the 55wh battery doesn’t swell as easily than 61wh, and the 61wh swelling gets mitigated by charging to 90%(55wh). What’s the difference between a factory 61wh battery and a 55wh battery chip-tuned to 61wh?
Meaning you’ll either have to go into the BIOS to fiddle with charging the threshold (flipping it from 90% back to 100%)…or ectool it if you’re running Linux.
Exactly. No difference in my book if you had to do a 61Wh - 10% just so it has the same level of aging reliability (as the 55Wh battery) in the long-plugged-in use case.
The 61Wh is over promised in this case of long-plugged-in.
It’s almost like a hardware regression via software (BIOS).
It’s 61Wh when you need it.
And its lifespan is fine if you’re not abusing the hell out of it. Sorry, but holding li-ions at 100% 24/7, day after day, is very hard on them. And that’s how all li-ions are.
I limit charge when plugged in for an extended time on all my devices.
For android, there is Advanced Charging Controller App (AccA) which offers options to dial back the charging rate as well, when you don’t need fast-charging, or optionally when battery temperature is over a configurable threshold.
It has schedule options too. For example, if you plug in your phone before going to sleep, as most do, you can create profiles to have it at 100% right when you wake, without the normal fast-charging & holding at 100% all night. Avoiding all that unnecessary battery stress. Instead it can slow-charge to a limit you set, holding that during the night. Then, shortly before morning, contiune charging right up to 100%, just in time for you to wake & take it off the charger. You have both 100% and you’ve prolonged the useful life of your battery. No downside.
According to Framework the wear occurs when the battery sits at 100% for over 5 consecutive days. They are producing a software update to automatically reduce the cap after 5 days, however in the meantime they suggest that the people regularly leaving it plugged in for 5 days straight can just apply that cap all the time.
