yep, still having the issue, even physically unplugged the battery to no avail, still plagued. this really needs to be fixed, my 7840u board never had this issue and its making me consider refunding
The AI 300 is more power hungry than Ryzen 5/7 7040U
Even more aggressive boosting? I would expect at least the 340 and 350 to have somewhat less peak power since half their cores are zen5c that canât boost as hard.
You mean like we should have, say, a 140w PD power supply?
The only way to get this fixed is for Framework to take an actual look at the fixes @James3 did in their fork, and see if it works as intended. And then release an official firmware release.
FW has been annoyingly quiet on all fronts regarding this, though. And Iâm not sure what to do to get more than a âframework takes this seriouslyâ and never actually see any changes
The main cause of battery flipping is the peak power demands of the CPU.
We have measured 497W on a FW16.
These are very short spikes in power demand, but they do cause the charging chip to momentarily draw from the battery.
This is caused by design problems related to how the usb power delivery works. Not any design fault on the FW13 / FW16.
I have a modified experimental EC than makes it function a lot better.
For the big ones, the cause of the small ones seems to be the weird moving vbus voltage thing.
do we know why the flipping isnât happening on windows, aparently?
Does windows maybe have a short grace period of not reporting the change, before it decides to tell a user?
You can also observe the flipping by watching the lights on the side, if it changes from white to red momentarily the battery is flipping
The flipping is happening regardless of os on the physical level, what the os does with the reported information is a whole other story.
The ec tells the cpu it can draw like 170w if it wants and it does that sometimes.
yup, thatâs what I mean.
Iâm thinking along the lines of: Linux reports the change immediately while Windows waits if the change persists for a moment before notifying the user
There is some debate going on on how that should be handled on linux in general as framework doesnât seem to be the only ones just letting the soc rip XD
The way I diagnosed and fixed the problem, with my custom EC firmware, was I put a counter on the flipping. So I could use an EC command and see how many times it had flipped since power on of the EC.
There are several aspects to the flipping:
- Changing from charging to not charging.
- Changing from using the PSU to using the PSU + Battery.
The EC counter I have does (1).
I cannot put a counter on (2) because that switch event is done in hardware, and the EC only controls the thresholds.
I donât think a non-custom EC has this counter.
But IIRC, 100W with AMD 7000 series was still exhibiting the charging / discharging behavious. So 100W already wasnât sufficient.
What are other manufacturers doing with their laptop design? How are they addressing thisâŚor are they just hiding it better?
If the ec tells the soc it can take (90% of charger) + 89W peak itâll dip into battery.
I did reduce that to just 90% of charger and with a 100W one everything was fine but below 65 there were serious performance issues. Ended up just going with limiting it to charger but at least 89W and performance wise itâs fine and battery dips are massively reduced. Stopping the moving voltage thing once it reached the desired state of charge took care of the little mini charge discharge cycles too.
Probably just reporting slower, the discharge cycles are very short.