Those numbers also related to specific pressure. I’ve tried Thermal Grizzly - Kryonaut Extreme (14.2 W/(m·K)) on Framework 13 and it performs much worse than Noctua NT-H2 (8.5 W/(m·K)), because expected significant pressure between cooler and CPU (like on Desktops).
Honeywell PTM7950 has same thermal conductivity as Noctua (8.5 W/(m·K) or up-to 11.5 in high temperatures, based on their reports - https://www.moddiy.com/reports/honeywell/ThermalInterfaceMaterials-Electronics-Brochure.pdf) but provides much-much better results with low-pressure cooler/CPU, like in laptops.
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The main point is that the values are pretty meaningless, what set of unacounted for variables cause it is a whole other question.
Again the values are meaningless but ptm does indeed perform leagues above paste and close to if not matching liquid metal. I am kind of sad I only figured out how the bypass the sapm throttling after I allready went to lm so I can’t really find out how close it gets but under 30w it’s pretty much a wash between lm and ptm on the framework 13. Crazy stuff that ptm, highly recommend it.
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Yes, totally agree - I have replaced PTM to both Intel and AMD Frameworks 13 I had and both gets 10C lower after that. I’m waiting replacement of FW16 Motherboard (current one R9 after ~20 seconds drops power from 52W to ~36-37W and one Core continuously on 100+C while FW13 on 20min+ on 32-33W get 82-86C only)… But maybe replacing paste/mat would be enough to fix the current one… Will see how new one would perform… (but I’m ready to update cooling solution if it would be about same)
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I use it on my Razer Blade 15 few years ago… it was working great first ~6 months, but then performance drops and thermals were very bad… After disassembling I figured out that there was corrosion on heatsink - so there was some chemical reaction looks like and copper heatsink “changed” to brown-silver sand-like substance… Hopefully there won’t be the case for heatsink plate in FW16, but just check thermals time-to-time and be ready to polish and reapply it again.
The 13 comes with paste by default so ptm is a lot better, if ptm outperforms the lm on the 16 framework may have messed something up.
That is relatively normal if you use lm on non plated heat-sinks, you can usually just add a little more to make up for the stuff that seeped into the copper and after the first time it lasts a lot longer. However these days just use ptm XD.
Also don’t use with aluminum unless you want hilarious but very messy results.
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I’m probably going to do the same thing. I’m moving into my dorm this weekend so I want to get that over with before worrying too much about this. Seems like it’s a pretty straightforward process looking at your other comment so hopefully it’ll be the same for me.
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I started my ticket asking for an RCA.
Here is my email if it helps you out:
After reviewing data from my laptop compared to other users within the forum. I would like to request an RMA for my mainboard.
The following forum posts point to many issues with a single core running hotter than other cores - as well as poor performance in benchmarks such as Cinebench R23.
https://community.frame.work/t/uneven-cpu-thermals/55614
https://community.frame.work/t/fw16-batch-20-guild/50405/330
https://community.frame.work/t/framework-laptop-16-user-reviews/44921/448
My issues are very similar. R23 score in the low 14k range, core 4 considerably higher than other cores, and CPU throttling happening very quickly.
I am willing to provide data from Fedora and Windows, both supported OS - however, the issue is related to the thermal application - and as such - I would like to request an RMA.
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so out of curiosity, does anyone know how you would go about trying to detect uneven cpu thermals under linux? per-core temperatures don’t seem to be available, for reasons that i don’t quite understand.
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Just to an Allcore Benchmark an see how much Wattage/TDP your CPU is pulling if its less than 45-50 than you are most likely massivly Thermal throttling.
Yup what @PSierra117 said.
I would use R23 from Cinebench (using lutris, steam, etc).
If you only get ppt in the 30s… request RMA
Is your laptop running on the 180W power brick? If not, you might encounter reduced performance due to limited power availability. None of your CPU cores is hitting 100°C, so I don’t believe it’s thermal throttling in this case.
I’ve just tested it again using the 180W brick and unfortunately the results are so similar it’s probably down to margin of error.
Are you in Maximum Performance Mode? If yes, thats an RMA
Just got my new board in today. Immediately fired up R23 on Fedora:
The results show about a 2k increase in score from the old board to the new.
Old board, it would thermal throttle and hold at 3.8ghz. This one is holding at 4.2 when it reaches 100c (I really dont trust linux temp reporting).
Ill take it as a win.
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I’m expecting my new board to be delivered today. Will post results once I’ve swapped it over.
@PSierra117
What size pad of PTM7950 (XXmm x XXmm) is needed to replace the Liquid Metal used for heatsink cooling.
Wanting to but some PTM7950 from moddiy.com, so I need to specify sheet/pad size to buy.
Thank you
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i got a 40x80 Pad, but thats enough to cut about 10 Sheets the Size of the Die. Better having than needing, a 40x40 should be enough to account for application Error and redoing. I also Applied PTM to my RX7700S.
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This can’t be an issue - if you use 60W brick, your battery would be slowly discharge and performance would be 20-25W, but temps would be 50-55C (just tested on my FW16). If temps are 100C and power less than 45-50W => it’s thermal throttling. I got very similar on my first motherboard and now after replacement I have ~95-96C with continuous 56W (Example here, on different thread).
Just do few days stress-idle loops by 5-10 mins. In my case temp settled from 100C to ~95C and continuous power razed from 48W to 56W. So looks like Liquid Metal also needs some time to settle. I bought new heatsink and I have PTM7950 (60x60) which I ordered from LTT store - $14.99, applied on few FW13 (few times each) and have more than half left. However, looks like I have good temps with LM - decided to left it as is for now.
If i am not on my 180w Charger my Device is putting out 55w for 3 seconds and than limits itself to 30w. Even when i put in my 96w charger my Screen integrates.