I’ve been using my FW16 for half a year now, with no hardware-related problems. So I’d buy it again. So anyone reading this thread, check on the forums for any computer you want to buy, and I’m sure you will find similar problems everywhere. Sometimes, electronics are just faulty, but most of the time it just works.
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I am not a framework owner myself. I must admit this is a little concerning to read and not the messaging that Framework puts out.
At the risk of going off-topic, I have also been following the MNT forum, makers of the Reform. Whilst I would like to get such a machine someday, the number of booting, overheating and charging problems being reported by users stays my hand somewhat. This on a machine which - relatively speaking - only a handful have been built and most of the customer base are enthusiasts. I know @2disbetter is an owner - how does the reliability of the two brands compare from personal experience?
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I will say that most of the laptops are fully functional and work quite well, but because the manufacturing processes have not been finely tuned, sometimes somewhat faulty units slip through. For the number of Framework Laptops shipped, the number of issues reported on the forum is actually quite small.
I had an overheating issue on my Framework 16’s cooling system, but it didn’t really affect daily use. The main issue was it wasn’t getting up to the expected performance level. Liquid metal is not an easy material to work with and this is Framework’s first attempt at a liquid metal cooled laptop, so sometimes you get unlucky and the unit doesn’t perform up to spec.
I’m sure given more time, Framework Laptops will certainly improve, but if you’re unlucky and get shipped with a faulty unit, you are going to have to work with support.
The main tinkering part is with the software, especially if you are going with an not officially or community supported OS. Framework has been pretty good at fixing the bugs and now they aren’t very frequent, but sometimes they still occur, like Windows BSODs due to driver issues.
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That’s been the on-going reasoning / justification / excuse for the past 3 years… At some point, it’s not going to fly any longer.
Can be hard to swallow.
Yeah, seems that way.
That’s me…kind of…but OMG, I really hated ‘my’ journey experience. (Because there are things that can’t be fixed on the 11th gen board. See my FL13 keyboard in the other thread…almost unused…paperweight)
Over the past three years though, one would expect things (e.g. reliability) to have improved.
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Why are you expecting framework to be better than like hP or DELL 
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Is he?
I would have arranged a return within the return period…without going through the support hoops. And re-evaulate if I want to make another Framework purchase, or…etc. With a return, you’re putting yourself (the situation) back onto a happy path, early. Money in your pocket means you still have options…and time.
(Honeymoon period should not be painful)
It is unfortunate that your experience has been far from optimal…but generally speaking, Framework Laptops do function relatively OK (i.e. not complete junk), but you need to vet out all the use cases / settings. You’re ultimately THE validation party.
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Return it, get something else, move on.
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Do you have any details? Which Framework do/did you have? 13", 16"? If it’s a 13", which mainboard/CPU? What operating system? What happens when it “crashes?” Is it a blue-screen issue? Something else?
Only curious. You’ve made a blanket “warning” not to buy any Framework products based on your experience. It would be nice to have a few details.
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Same here. I have my FW16 on almost 24/7 and game on it every other night at least. Been rock solid. Not sure what this guy is on about, but that’s not my experience at all.
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I share the same experience, FL16 near 12 hours everyday for work and gaming, one blue screen because of the first bios version then not any since the end of march 
Hope you’ll have a fix of some sort. Just avoid unecessary alarming title, even more with so few information
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I bought a Framework a year ago, and it handles the craziest Minecraft TNTs (mods) better than my brother’s 2000€ Gaming Laptop (from 2018).
So, you’re problem is a special case.
If you had Windows, it’s crap. (Ok, that’s a personal opinion which doesn’t help much, I guess).
Anyway, Framework laptops are amazing. Of course there are things to improve here and there, but that’s just inherent to cutting edge technology and design : it’s experimental nature is what makes it so amazing too !
Computer from the 90s are from another world. Certainly reliable, but also not very powerful.
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I find it quite puzzling that the original poster damns all Framework computers, claims to have all sorts of problems and, yet, never gives any details about the problems or the configuration of their Framework computer, and never replies or posts again. This makes me wonder if this is nothing more than a MacFan or WindowsFan who thinks Framework computers and, perhaps Linux, are a threat to their personal favorite brand of computers and operating systems and is simply trolling…perhaps not even an owner of a Framework computer? Given the huge improvements in all operating systems in the past 30 years, it seems quite unlikely that a computer from the 1990s, running Windows 3.1 or Windows 95 or Mac “Classic” OS from the 1990s would be superior to a decent current computer running one of the better Linux distros or even a current Windows or a current Mac OS version.
Y’all, nah. I find windows deplorable and mac is not my favorite either. Pure linux fan here. I have a framework running the recommended os. The hardware simply blows.
I have spent days worth of hours of my life sending videos to the support team repeating the same troubleshooting steps they keep feeding me over and over and over. Many times every single day, everything on my screen just freezes. Like, not blue screen, nothing fancy, just freeze. Everything stuck exactly where it is, and nothing will happen again until I hard restart the computer. I’m not looking for any more troubleshooting suggestions. I already tried those recommended by the community and, as mentioned, the support team. (See: fed up, cutting my losses after days worth of hours of my life sunk, I tend to enjoy tinkering but gotta draw a line SOMEWHERE).
The problems started cropping up just a couple weeks after the end of the warranty period so no that’s not an option. I’ve pleaded and begged with support to get any replacement parts to no avail. People are in here telling me not to talk trash about all framework computers when I haven’t used all framework computers. Of course I haven’t used all framework computers. I’m a single human being.
I’m so happy for everybody who has one and loves it. I can only possibly speak from the perspective of my experience, and I do wanna share, so that anybody can see, that some framework experiences are really quite negative.
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This is called “once you’ve been in tech a while, you end up hating 90% of your customers!”
It happens to everyone in tech. Natural way of things.
Think about it, the bigger you get the more “less clever” you have to deal with. Initially Frameworks customer base was pretty clued up and enthusiast. You can work with that. The bigger and more exposed you get…the more less clued up customers you get.
“So can I install my SATA drive in this?”
In which case they made a big mistake: in my experience Apple fanboiz are not a patch on the Framework zealot!
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As a person that acquired my laptop for my small business, I expected very few hiccups with the Framework laptop I received. I bought the AMD 7840U with the 2.8k screen added 32gb ram and a 1tb ssd.
The reality was a little different than that. I performed many actions above and beyond what a reasonable person should expect to do to a new laptop. I do not blame Framework for that, but I also couldn’t keep the laptop for it’s intended purpose. It just did not suit the needs of this small business owner without an internal team dedicated to device hardware/software concerns.
I will strongly consider purchasing a framework device for my personal needs when I reach that point. It just wasn’t fool proof enough, for what I needed.
Framework is currently in the process of accepting my return and I see no reason why it wouldn’t go smoothly based on our ongoing communications.
I could be angry it didn’t work out for me, but that anger wouldn’t be justified if directed at this company based on my experience(s).
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I mean, if you’re out of warranty, then you’re kind of on your own really. Definitely, not a pleasant experience, and you might expect better longevity, but the thing is, there would always be manufacturing variations amongst the parts that are shipped, and you need to be ready to be the unlucky one.
When I was a Dell XPS enthusiast, all I really wanted out of Dell was a first-party known-good parts store, and here you are supported really nicely if ever you’re in the situation where you’re out of warranty, or just did accidental damage to your machine.
Well, in my case, doesn’t hurt that EU has a mandatory 2-year warranty window. And I also just learned that Spain, I guess, has an even longer warranty.
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There is a thread here that talks about things that could be improved on a FW16:
And also things that we would like to see improved in the current FW16 and delivered as a BIOS update:
I think a combination of those two would make for a laptop that more people would buy.
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