I’m with @Marek here. The laptop market isn’t fully explored, and it lets you continue to build on your core competencies.
I’d love to see an option built on an AMD or ARM platform. The limit to Intel is one of the two reasons I’m on the fence about buying a Framework laptop.
The other reason is form factor. I’m a middle-aged geek with old-person eyesight and bad knees. Small screens and small batteries are my bane. I’d instantly buy a larger version of the Framework so I can have the things I need to operate off my dock for days at a time instead of a couple of hours here and there.
With the existing form factor, eye fatigue is going to hit me fast. The screen on my 14.1" Thinkpad is on the small side of usable…I can use it for about 6 hours/day without my eyes giving up on me. Before you say it’s quality not size, my 14" Macbook Pro is just the same. I’d also like room for a bigger battery, or an additional one. I’d much rather have a heavier, bulkier laptop than have to wonder when I’ll have to sit in a corner where I can find an outlet at some event, and possibly not get up off the floor again without help.
A 15" or 16" Framework laptop with room to build in ~16 hours of battery life would sell me fast…along with many of my colleagues.
This is kinda random and I guess probably might not be worth it.
But a modular case like what InWin has done is really cool. Maybe an idea for a next product but the certifications and the manufacturing volume might make it very expensive for Framework though.
I have another idea though this is kinda niche again.
If you look at Intel NUC Compute Elements, they can be plugged in into the PCIe slot and act as a secondary PC for video capture/stream processing.
Maybe we can reuse mainboards to work like that too with a 3D printed PCIe adaptor and maybe a PCIe 8-pin power connector (to the battery or as a special expansion card) to power it up. When the main PC boots into Windows, it will be recognized as an additional card that can be selected for encoding etc.
Something like a Mini STX motherboard that needs an external power supply and can be equipped with a massive heat sink and a Noctua fan to make it super silent even under load.
I missed a chance to buy one of these and they don’t make them anymore
Something I’d love to exist is a reasonably priced eInk external display that could also be used as a “tablet” connecting wirelessly to the Framework’s “brains”.
Purpose 1: Could be used as an additional monitor when docked with the Framework as a “status” display (eg put calendar, Spotify, or anything else that’s fine with SPF instead of FPS rendering speeds). Would be great to include some sort of VESA mount adaptor, so the screen can easily be clicked into and out of place as needed between purpose 1 and 2.
Purpose 2: If you need to sit and read some long documents, you can unmount the eInk display, lock the Framework, and go walk over to the couch to get comfy while reading. It doesn’t need its own brains, or at least not complex ones, as it can just call back to the Framework for any tasks beyond scrolling. eInk latency is already crap, so adding round-trip-time to eg typing a comment on said document shouldn’t be additionally too painful. And not needing its own brains should keep it lighter too!
Imagine needing to read a bunch of Confluence pages or email for work and being able to leave your laptop at your desk and get comfy, but it’s still technically on the same device (as it’s using the Framework’s brains) so you don’t have to worry about signing in again or getting a separate device accepted onto the corporate network or re-finding the documents you need; just move the windows to the right screen, sleep the rest of the laptop, and walk to the couch. And if it’s a colour eInk display, add “reviewing PRs” to that list of use cases!
Purpose 3: Not sure how applicable in the newly remote-hybrid world we’re in, but also having the ability to store hand-written notes locally and have a convert-handwriting-to-text option when back in range of the Framework, for taking to meetings. Again, being lighter than a full laptop, would be easier for those running from one meeting room to the next all day, and if there’s an option to convert-handwriting-to-text to then easily copy/paste into a Confluence/Notion page or email, I could see that being useful!
You REALLY NEED to build a good keyboard for your laptop first! A keyboard with a NIPPLE that is!
I very much want to give you the money for my next ultra portable instead of Lenovo, but this really is a deal breaker for the ultra portable!
GIVE US THE NIPPLE!!
There are a lot of people for which a laptop computer means only one thing: an Ibm/Lenovo Thinkpad! For me it’s like this for some 20 years.
This may be a niche, but one worth persuing, since most of people buying it won’t look too much at the price if the product is good. You could/should charge a hefty premium for such a keyboard. But you need to build a good product, not like the half ass solution that Dell built in their Latitude lineup.
Also consider the marketing value of the keyword that I am talking about: it will give you access to a lot of the people that decide which hardware gets bought by the company. This could get you some big, predictable revenue streams!
I agree a bit!
Having more options for keyboards would be very cool to appeal to more audience!
As well as more trackpad options; for instance with buttons.
I’m on the other side of that. I just hate trackpads in general, so I’m curious to try a trackpoint. But looking at their machines currently on offer it really looks like they’re going the full-on Macbook route.
I think you should run with the laptop idea a bit more before moving into other products. I was just talking about Framework laptops at work with 2 other colleagues who have them and we all agreed that we love the concept and are behind it 100% but want to see more options for display panels, keyboards, and peripherals. Among the things we mentioned were:
1.) keyboards. Different layouts with the Fn and Ctrl keys swapped. A bigger 7 row with a smaller trackpad. Maybe even a trackpoint version too. If you could somehow get mechanical switch options, that would be awesome.
2.) Displays. A lower res display as an option would be nice, since scaling doesn’t always work well. Love the 3:2 aspect ratio though.
3.) More mainboard options. AMD, ARM, RISC-V, etc. This might involve encouraging other companies. Ideally Framework is not the only company making boards for these laptops. If SiFive came out with a RISC-V board for these, I’d buy one. But for the concept to really flourish, it needs more aftermarket support.
A LapDock type device based on the existing Framework chassis definitely sounds attractive to me. I’d like to see the ecosystem expand, and bringing the same product core to a broader spectrum of use cases would make sense in many ways.
And in case you’re going for a NUC type device/dock, tablet or phone next, it’s a great way to extend the ecosystem in a way that lets products play well together.
And it would play well with the module system, too. Storage is a good thing to have, if you swap between different devices.
edit: And let’s not forget that repurposing hardware is one of the main things, that make Framework attractive. Having a way to repurpose the chassis itself is definitely nice. Maybe unlocking the drive with the fingerprint reader could be a thing? Or networking if multiple ‘hosts’ get plugged in at the same time? I can even see ways to innovate on the firmware/software front because of the flexibility of the module system. And above all, it’s well in the spirit of reusability/repairability
A laptop shell that vents out the back of the laptop case, not the bottom.
(might solve your overheating) I’ve been told they vent out the back, if so then withdraw this one. However I don’t see adequate venting out the back. I’ll upload an example of what I’m suggesting. If it’s added to the 12th gen already, then disregard this suggestion.
A NIC module that fits the same way the other modules do. The way it sticks out, it may
as well be an old school pcmcia card. I’m still glad it got made though. No RJ45 is a deal breaker when you’re working with networking etc.
A module with 2x USB-A and or 2x USB-C ports
A new battery that would enable longer battery life. Not necessarily bigger, but more efficient.
Begin looking into solid state batteries as they seem to be one the rise.
I would like to see a few things Framework’d (you can use that btw)
Mobile Phone (More like the Fair Phone, but better?)
Tablet
SBC (Not for development, just a micro PC.)
Smartwatch (would be nice, but I can understand it not being in the wheelhouse)
Monitor (Totally doable, swapable panels would be nice for tuning your setup exactly how you want it, with the outputs you want with it too using expansion modules, if possible powered via USB-C)
eGPU (Yes, this needs to happen)
Docking station (Essentially its just a platform you slot modules into, which would cross work with the expansion modules)
4/5G Modem Module
GPS Module
This is all stuff I would buy, and would attempt to convince others to buy too.
I’ve recently become very interested in getting one to replace my loud and hot desktop and hopefully, to replace my Raspberry Pi 4 as an always-on server/ HTPC; I’m particularly interested in one of:
Beelink GTR5/ GTR6
Minisforum UM690
Minisforum HX90
However, they are seem to share the following flaws:
Poor cooling (and so, noisy fans - not good for an always-on server!); usually afflicted by one of the following:
Fan whirring incessantly, even when idle (and cool)
Fan going from 0 - JET ENGINE BLAST when the temperature goes up by even 1C above idle
Fan flipping back and forth irritatingly between two different speeds, even when cool
This wouldn’t be so bad except that none of the above expose fan control to the operating system(!) so you’re completely at the mercy of the EC firmware.
Additionally, Technical Support is pretty bizarre: just finding out what version of the BIOS is current is non-trivial, and you there’s no site to download it from - instead, you have to email them and request it!
If you were to ask for, say, the EC source code they would probably think you mad
A representative thread from the last few days can be found here:
Needless to say, I think Framework could do better on all fronts!
Everyone is getting carried away here. Framework would do well to concentrate on just the laptop in its current form, as they’re already falling behind in supporting it and keeping it updated properly.
12th Gen BIOS 3.06 has been in beta since December 2022, after vulnerabilities were announced in September 2022. That means lag time from public announcement of a vulnerability in their BIOS to final release of fixes for the Framework laptop BIOS is currently around >= 5 MONTHS. And yet we are seeing forum posts about developing entirely new product lines.
Intel 13th gen has been out for a bit now. No sign of AMD motherboards. ARM-based laptop-grade solutions are on the horizon. Other manufacturers rapidly standardizing to high refresh rate screens. Vastly superior touchpads. DDR5 moving to CAMM, with the likelihood that we’ll be seeing quite a few more laptops with upgradeable RAM and storage, removing one of the main advantages of the Framework platform. Other laptops are becoming more repairable than you might realize as the legal framework (sorry) has changed in certain jurisdictions (e.g. France).
Not to mention no diagnosis or lessons learned regarding the Framework’s horrible battery life and how they plan to at least fix this on future iterations.
I own a 12th gen Framework and do like it, since I don’t need it to last for even a reasonable period of time without being plugged in, but…
Framework really needs to get it together with their primary product. The rest of the industry is just iterating so much faster and they seem to just be content with their first device and have called it a day.
