I’ve been thinking about the direction of the Framework Desktop / Mini PC ecosystem, especially as someone interested in compact and SFF builds. I appreciate what the Framework Desktop is trying to do, there’s a clear emphasis on design and user accessibility. However, I hope future iterations lean more heavily into true modularity rather than a tightly defined, fixed configuration.
Right now, the system feels restrictive in ways that limit its potential. Even though Framework offers key components like the case and PSU, the overall design doesn’t fully translate into a flexible platform for people who want to experiment or adapt beyond the intended configuration. For example, it would be incredibly valuable if the case itself were marketed as a more universal SFF case option.
I was recently looking at Mini-ITX cases for a SFF build and remembered the Framework Desktop, but then found myself going through a list of reasons of why it would be a bad idea. The absence of PCIe slot support, or even simple punch-outs for potential future expansion (hopefully a new main board or a 3rd party motherboard) along with a PSU that isn’t modular or doesn’t offer additional connections, makes it harder to consider as an SFF case. I likely wouldn’t always use it for gaming, and see value in PCIe expansion for things like a 10GbE network card or NVMe PCIe expansion. It could potentially make a great Proxmox server with some more flexibility.
On a more specific note, I like the NVMe built in latches, but don’t think its a good idea for the rear NVMe slot since it could also limits alternative uses. I am unclear whether the latch mechanism could be removed, it may prevent repurposing that connection. Some users, myself included, might be interested in adapting it for something like OCuLink. The current layout and lack of rear I/O accommodations make it difficult to get creative.
Overall, I don’t think Framework needs to reinvent the wheel, there’s a strong opportunity to deliver a high-quality, premium SFF case with a modular PSU and broader compatibility. There aren’t many options in this space; one example is the Velkase Velka 3. Leaning further int standard compatibility and physical design would make the platform far and specially the case more compelling for enthusiasts and builders in the SFF community and will allow it to be used for a lot more uses.
The rather useless PCIe slot due to lacking a half-height slot cover in the back of the case was a tooling swing and a miss. Reinforced because of the limited power budget for the slot.
Granted, there aren’t that many uses for a PCIe slot anymore beyond a NIC. Everything is USB/Thunderbolt now. And the onboard NIC on the FD is quite good–unless you’re doing large NAS transfers on your LAN it is more than fine. Granted the audience for the FD is exactly that sort–but you need a router and a NAS that can both surpass 5gb LAN which for NASes isn’t common. My wifi7 router only has 2.5gb LAN.
no, yea the other way around works pretty well. But then there wouldn’t be a need for a more flexible case, I was trying to make the point that I like how unique and fun looking the Framework Desktop. It’s just a shame a couldn’t buy the case individually for more general purposes (which dont require as much power/or cost as much as the Ryzen AI MAX) like having a portable mini pc with oculink for occasional gaming, media pc, or even server
I’ve had a different experience. 2.5G is becoming the standard, and 10GbE is increasingly the preferred choice for most people in the homelab community.
Most popular Wi-Fi 7 routers and mesh systems being released, as you mentioned, start with 2.5G connections. At the same time, 10G is now much more accessible than it used to be. You can find 10G switches for under $100, and even Framework now offers a 10G module. Similarly, 10G PCIe cards are often available for under $100, whether you’re building a DIY or grabbing an off the shelf NAS like Synology or Ugreen, they usually offer upgrade path to 10G in their better models.
While USB4+ and Thunderbolt 5 are very nice, I often find them underutilized. For example, Thunderbolt 5 still isn’t as effective for eGPU gaming as OCuLink. Additionally, many devices either don’t support these technologies at all or have it poorly implemented. The dream of keeping my PC in another room and using a single dock setup elsewhere also isn’t practical yet due to cable length limitations.
Do you mean the Framework case or a generic SFF case? Either way, I do see the option to buy the case individually in Framework’s marketplace.
I agree with your suggestion of choosing an SFF case and installing the Framework Desktop mainboard inside. That said, unless you have very specific preferences, I think most people would agree that the Framework Desktop case is already very well-designed and highly customizable to individual tastes.
If you’re planning to buy the Framework Desktop mainboard, I don’t really see a strong reason to go with a different case. Any advantages or added flexibility from a generic case likely wouldn’t be fully usable with this specific mainboard, so it’s probably best to stick with the official case.
All that said, my main point was that a future iteration of the Framework Desktop could benefit from making the case itself more flexible or modular and marketed as it’s own product even if the mainboard remains largely the same (soldered in CPU and/or RAM, although I’m sure everyone would prefer LPCAMM2)
They better be, even cheap wifi6(non e) aps are bottlenecked by gigabit allready.
I don’t really see how tunneled pcie is ever gonna beat raw pcie (copper or optical) in that application on performance. By the time you got better tunneled stuff you also got better raw stuff on whatever connector the server market is using for pcie at that point.
Optical cables for pretty much anything exist, they are just expensive as all hell but they remove most cable length limitations within reason.
Optical cables are not too expensive and plentiful on Amazon. Have been for years.
Whereas Corning optical cables are $400, generic no-name optical displayport and USB cables are under $100. I’ve used that setup for my Windows gaming PC for years with my HP Omen monitor as a KVM
The whole optical cables route is true, I have seen the corning optical cables, I think it was the only option a consumer could buy when I was looking into the topic and I think it was limited to thunderbolt 3. I am not sure how close we are to something like 150ft of optical thunderbolt 5 but HDMI (although I wish DP) has a few great options in the market for whatever length you want optical. Peripherals is where it gets interesting because there are many ways to go about it, and many of them are probably as expensive as the Corning optical cable, usb over ethernet is probably the cheapest I know.
Well, it shouldn’t matter for me now since I have my server rack next to my desk but hopefully in the future whenever I get around to owning a house I can run fiber and by then hopefully there are more options than corning since competition is great.
I want a second GPU in my Framework desktop, nothing fancy just like an Intel arc or amd. The iGPU only supports 4 display outs regardless of you you split things.
10gbit rj45 would be trivial, they just gotta swap the chip for the new 10gbit version front eh previous 5gbit one. Sfp+ would be somewhat more difficult.
Well…There are only so many PCIe lanes to connect things with Strix Halo only has 16 lanes. And I think everything is connected to the APU via lanes–I can’t find a handy AMD block-diagram of the Strix Halo arch to confirm.
Which, if I’m right, than they can solder a new chip in, but it’ll be bottlenecked by the available PCIe lanes which are already all allocated as is. ANd folks want more than an x4 slot on the motherboard already.
4 line pcie4 for main Nvme
4 line pcie4for back Nvme
4 line pcie4 for Pcie Slot
1 line pcie4 for wifi/bt cart (2 possible on the connector so not 100% sure)
1 line downgrade in pcie3 for the 5Gbits ethernet.
2 line left,
only 1 Pcie 4 (16Gbps) is needed for 10Gbits ethernet.
so like @Adrian_Joachim suggest is simple, juste une the actual Pcie Line use for the 5Gbps eth and replace with a 10Gbits chip (not sure if a simple replacement, the pin may be in an other order but yes both a realtek so heighgly possible.)
It look for me even possible to have 2x10Gbps eth (I can’t find where the 16e line is use.)
For now if you don’t need the wifi/BT card, you can fined 10Gbps ethernet that match with the connector. (like that https://auvidea.eu/product/m20e-m-2-10gbe/ but need to be checked!)
That’s the neat part, the 5gbit nic has 1 pcie4 lane, the new 10gbit revision of this nic only needs 1 pcie4 lane so that is pretty much a drop in replacement. I am currently running that nic in a pcie4x1 slot on my pc because it behaves better than the aquantia nic I used before.
Pretty sure if that nic came out a few months earlier they’d have put it in the fw desktop.
