Hi,
can I get higher PL1 or longer PL2 values with Throttlestop.
I am planning to watercool the framework Laptop (like my XPS13) for noise and compute power reasons. It would be nice to always run on PL2 limit and squeeze out all power you can get from the CPU, because Temps are no problem in this scenario.
My XPS 13 9360 with i7-8550u runs at 50W PL2 (28s) and 46W PL1 with max. 75°C. It scores about 4600 points on cinebench R23, so it’s close to i7-1165G7@28W. And it’s totally mobile with my solution, because it’s just an thermal connection between the cooler and a watercooled coldplate under the Laptop. And that would be my goal with the framework laptop too.
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Yea, I saw a Intel NUC recently at looking at the options inside Intel’s Visual BIOS by AMI, has loads of options and features, kinda wished we had those.
Same here. The Framework laptop is pretty locked down in the BIOS…somewhat disappointing…but I can see that’s their way to limit support calls / variations.
I wish there’s an opened version of the BIOS for those that are now outside of warranty. …and coreboot is nowhere to be seen with the 11th gen yet.
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I am still skeptical if Coreboot will be able to achieve the tight integration compared to like motherboard vendors or even like Intel’s own where they probably have non open source code that allows finer tuning or even lower level adjustments.
Same here. A less locked down version of the Insyde BIOS would be more likely / suitable (?)…if only Framework would release it. I might be wrong, but I’m somehow under the impression that the BIOS is a ‘product’ from Insyde, one that Framework decided on how it’s to be configured / packaged / utilized.
I haven’t come across any recent, detailed and credible (within past 5 years) laptop reviews that documents / discusses the available / exposed BIOS configurations… Maybe that’s an area laptop reviewers can shine a light on.
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I am currently working on a workaround to enable ReBAR on an old donated i5-4690k system to test run (gaming and encoding) for Intel A770 and A380. During this process, I have found some tools that exposes BIOS options that are hidden away (because it wasn’t needed and thus untested), which in my case was ReBAR which was there since PCIe Gen 2. So maybe it can work for Framework, but I don’t have a spare throwaway machine (unlike my Desktop) in case I brick it.
If I’m not mistaken, BIOS modding / patching is now a thing of the past…mostly. These days, BIOS / firmware are largely cryptographically signed (unless factory disabled).
Yes, I would expect it to be so. I know Intel 6th Gen ones can be still modified, I haven’t tried on the 9th and 10th gens in my house (3 of them aren’t mine).
I’ve undervolted my CPU on my XPS13 with PowerMonkey and doubled the powerlimits by dividing the current readout by 2 by editing the BIOS settings in the UEFI Shell… Link
In my case I edited this value:
0x5EA 0x32 Numeric: IMON Slope, VarStoreInfo (VarOffset/VarName): 0x5EA, VarStore: 0x1, QuestionId: 0x269, Size: 1, Min: 0x0, Max 0xC8, Step: 0x1
And the BIOS Dump showed me, that all options (overclocking, RAM Speeds and so on) are here, but just not visible. But it’s very uncomfortable to edit settings this way 
Well, it was possible and now my XPS13 runs very well, but I hoped an open Hardware Developer will open the Software (BIOS) too.
But it’s also clear, that there will be more support calls and problems with users. Maybe this could be solved similar to unlocking bootloaders on Android Phones. Many companys give you the option to unlock and install custom Roms but then you will not receive any further support or even have no warranty on hardware from that point.
7th gen XPS13 is signed too…
And with all BIOS Updates to adress Intels security Issues, they dropped the ability to undervolt with Throttlestop and then lowered Dell the Powerlimit from 23W to 15W. That was dissapointing. I’ve bought a 23W System and then they reduced the Power.
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Yea, I heard of this horror story, that’s the plundervolt one right? Fortunately all the Intel systems in my home are locked (for good or for worse), except the 4690k, which I heard isn’t affected.
But it really sucks to pay for a feature only for it to be disabled.
On your topic, I am trying to see if there’s a way to use the Framework as an Single Board Computer and mount a water block or tower cooler to see how long I can prolong the boost. But I haven’t got around doing it.
Better than 90% of laptops I get in to work on, trust me. Boot order and switching off VM features is usually it.
I do. Laptop BIOSes leave much to be desired. It’s a sad state.
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I think it’s a matter of warranty.
On buying a mainboard separately, the mainboard manufacturer can give you the full control to set e.g. the voltage much too high for the CPU with risking a permanent damage. But if you are buying an mainboard with soldered CPU, then the manufacturer limits everything in the BIOS to prevent damage or bad behavior of your device.
That’s something I can understand, but for advanced users it would be nice to get the full control of your device with taking all risks.
Do you think it would be possible to mail someone at framework that can try to open their BIOS in any way?
I must say not sure what else I’d want from the Framework BIOS. maybe some RAM timing tweaking. That’s about it for me. Not worried about overclocking a laptop, but having the ability to underclock on the Framework is a serious bonus.
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That I can understand…for in-warranty units.
My first post is more on the now out-of-warranty units. I would like to have fuller control of the hardware.
Fan curves / profiles (independent of OS utility / scripts), RAM timing, PL1/2, tau…
Alternatively, another way to look at this…why the change of form factor (desktop to laptop) must change the BIOS configuration options available to end users? Like, I get that the smaller form factor means there’s a narrower window of operational environment conditions…(less fan headers, less thermal headroom…). But if the mainboard is truly marketed as a NUC candidate (that 3D printed case)…then the question stands. Otherwise, it’s just a feel-good marketing approach…“here, have a case”…an afterthought.
Z790 configurations example:
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Fair point on the NUC angle. Fan curves could be handy for some I guess.
Plus, I believe (don’t have actual stats to back this up with), a fair amount of users here are makers / tweakers / tinkerers…feature-rich use case flexibility would be nice.
Actually thinking about it, there is one bit I would like some adjustment on and that’s the iGPU.
Being able to up the Hz a bit would be nice.