Could be indeed a lot clearer on the geo expansion roadmap, my guess is they don’t know either so releasing estimates is hard?
They’re missing out on customers due to lack of transparency on the shipping front.
They are still selling out the batches well, so probably they don’t feel the urge to have more customers, until production levels are higher than what they can sell to the current markets easily.
I don’t like this, since it negatively affects me(they still don’t ship to any country which would work for me, so I had to use a forwarding service), but as a business, this makes perfect sense.
What they could improve on is the messaging though.
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In a world of continuous permanet instant communication, it is better not to communicate at all most of the time. If you do méditation, the answer lots of time is to just do nothing.
If they tell you A 30% of customers will be disapointed.
If you tell the opposite B 30% will ne also disapointed.
If you tell nothing 5% discuss on the forum
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In the global world we live in with fierce competition the line between making it or going bust is a slim one for startups.
My main concern for Frame.work is that at any point a competitor could appear with much more aggressive expansion plan and deeper wallets and throw them out of the game.
Being online for more than 1.5 years and still selling in batches is not good enough, not supporting most of the world is not good enough.
Regarding communication I respectfully disagree. Been open and honest about the plans is much more appreciated by the community rather than hiding behind obscurity and the recent examples in the tech world are many.
And it is a real pity cause their laptop really ticks all boxes for me…
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I agree that too much communication might be a bad idea, but telling your customers an estimate on when they might receive the ability to give their money to you is kinda a minimum for me?
A lot of companies do it and it’s not like it would impact sales. It just gives the customer a reasonable timeline to expect the laptop. - Some transparency is appreciated.
Right now I don’t even know if I’m ever gonna be able to get a framework laptop as I have no idea in what capacity the company is even at. - They might be going bankrupt as far as I know.
(Not saying I want an exact date just like an idea - Next year, this year, 5 years from now?)
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Source?
There is no source, that’s the point.
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Yay! Australia has shipping, I’m guessing as they’ve been able to ship to one of the harder countries to manage logistics with the rest of EU members will be getting support soon!
So excited to get my hands on a Framework as I’ve been waiting for quite some time 
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Hi, I just found this thread and I wanted to know how was the experience for the users who indeed used a mail forwarding service.
Since I live in Italy I am also desperately waiting for the shipping to open up for my country as well, but not trusting the Italian market to be very interested I am afraid that could take a while.
The fact that I wouldn’t get support (if I were to choose to get a FW laptop with a mail forwarding service) does not bother me that much, but maybe I am underestimating the problem…
Any thoughts?
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Hi @matteo_becchis! 
- Welcome to the forum 
If you are able to, I’d wait a bit more. FW seems to be readying up new countries and as popular as Italy is I have no doubt it’ll be on the new couple roll-outs! 
There still seems to be a bit of an issue with quality control on FW’s end so having to send back the laptop (or parts) is highly unlikely but not impossible, and with a country not being supported that would mean having to use a forwarding service again to RMA the parts / laptop.
That’s only my opinion though, and if you haven’t already: read some other stories about forwarding the FW laptop here~
Hope this helps!
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Thanks @Cheese for the comprehensive reply!!
Yeah, in the end, I think I am in fact going to wait for FW to reach Italy as well, as the wait might be shorter than I expected.
Checking the Marketplace, in fact, I saw there are several keyboard layouts that are “coming soon”, including the Italian one (not that I will be buying it as I am used to a US layout), which I don’t see why they would be developing/adding to the website if not to appease a future Italian market.
Hopefully, 2023 will be the year we get to buy it here as well!!! 
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Not sure if you would be able to place an order for a new machine built with a US keyboard layout. Based on other things I’ve read, the order page is regionalized. You may have to purchase a US layout separately.
Best wishes to you.
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@matteo_becchis Yep! I’m waiting too. The Belgian keyboard also states ‘coming soon’ so I’ll be a happy FW user once they release to my region.
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Hey, thanks for your pointer (I’m Italian too, hence the interest). Do you have any pointer on the “readying”? I know this question was asked one thousand times in one thousand forms, but I would like to just understand by “readying” you have in mind more “1/2 months” or “1/2 years”… and on what basis.
Ten months have passed already since the FW has been first available for preorder in EU (UK, DE and FR)… and I have not found any even vague estimate of what’s next.
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Welcome to the community, no worries at all I’ll try to provide some sources!
First of all, this is all guess-work based on facts so try to not take everything seriously, or better take your own conclusions out of my sources
The new keyboard skews.
Framework has made a forum post to ask the community for keyboard Q/C so they don’t get anything wrong.
Source 1: Request: Review of Italian, Spanish (Spain), and Chinese (Traditional) keyboards
Source 2: Request: Review of Korean, Belgian, Japanese, and Latin American keyboards
Spinning up
Unlike what we’ve seen in the first 2 years, the company seems te be coming out with products way faster than before. They developed and sold out of ethernet expansion cards, launched the Chromebook Edition, partnered with Blue Tide, moved into a new office and probably more behind the scenes! They’re also hiring new people.
Source 1 (New office): https://twitter.com/FrameworkPuter/status/1570203352071536641
Source 2 (Sold out): https://twitter.com/FrameworkPuter/status/1569859445991292928
Source 3 (Blue Tide): https://twitter.com/FrameworkPuter/status/1564345689840111616
Source 4 (Chromebook Ed.): Framework | Introducing the Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition
Source 5 (New hire): The two Firmware Engineer roles have been filled? - #11 by nrp
Source 6 (Broadening shipping locations): Framework | Manufacturing starts on the new Framework Laptop in Taiwan
Time
We haven’t really seen what time it took between planning and roll-out but if we base ourselves of the Australian release I’d guess Q1 2023? Maybe if we’re lucky they’ll allow pre-ordering in the holiday season, although they would need a lot of stock to do this, so I’m guessing that’s not going to happen.
However, we’re talking like months, maybe one year? - Q1 -Q2 2023 is my presumption.
Source 1: Now available for pre-order in Australia
Maybe we’ll get 13th gen or an AMD or ARM version by then? (I would absolutely love an ARM version)
Hope this helps!
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Thanks for your extensive reply. To be honest, at least some of the elements you cite had turned me more pessimistic than optimistic - like they are just focusing on other stuff rather than on expanding the set of countries (the Chromebook does not even ship to the EU countries where the laptop does!) But anyway, thanks for the detailed list. I guess I will keep my fingers crossed… a bit more, then give up.
Sorry to bring this topic back up but I’m still confused why there is no shipping to any country in the EU, let alone the world? Just adjust the VAT price for each country and shipping cost and send it. Someone mentioned cars but that’s comparing apples to oranges. And again, that doesn’t make it impossible either. If you want a Mercedes delivered to you from Germany to Spain, they will send it to you. Yes it will cost a lot more, but Mercedes won’t stop you from buying their car. And if some service repair had to be done we still have to mail it anyway, there isn’t a Framework store to bring it to. So what is it?
Edit: My only theory is it’s related to limited supply. I guess somehow it saves money on logistics if you focus on shipping to countries with highest demand first? It doesn’t make sense to me, only where to base a warehouse. But since 7 countries in Europe (6 in the EU) can receive Frameworks now, then I’m guessing there aren’t 7 warehouses.
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Yep, the problem seems to be undoubtedly the limited supply.
It is to be expected, for a “small” company like FW to not have yet a fluent manufacturing operation as that needs A LOT of money.
That being said, I am growing impatient for the shipment to open up here as well. Personally, I am going to wait until the end of the year/ Q1 2023.
After that, FW will take my money whether they have opened shipment or not…
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I got my laptop in Slovenia! But it wasn’t easy, I didn’t want to use a proxy since they mentioned you loose warranty in this case.
So I got a friend, who has a friend that works in Austria to order it for me and brought it to Slovenia when he went home for a visit I guess this is still a valid order that doesn’t break warranty conditions?
In any case I hope I won’t need it and I’m super happy for my new lappy 
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Still waiting on availability in belgium.
I even willing to tolerate french keyboard and order from france and pay for extra shipment, but not possible.
Why do you guys hate belgian, I mean I get it, belgium sucks, gouvernament and justice system is as corrupt as a 3rd world country and we are beeing bleed dry by taxes, but there are nice people, mainly me, I want to buy a framework laptop and advise them to all my customers and finally bring repairability and upgradeability back
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