Framework Owners - is it time to upgrade to Windows 11 from 10?

As the title would imply, I’m wondering what your collective experience has been? I was briefly on 11 about 3 month ago, and was having some resume from standby issues that drove me nuts. I saw a BIOS update that addressed that, and I’m wondering what you all think about 11? Is it stable? Have you had any issues on it? What does standby, sleep, hibernation look like on it?

Thanks for any and all feedback!

I have been on Windows 11 since the first day of getting my Framework. I use it as my daily (work, gaming, movies… EVERYTHING) and have never had issues. As for sleep, it goes to sleep when I close the lid or if it’s unplugged and running for more than 20 minutes (because I set it that way)… but using the power button to sleep usually takes a few 2-3 attempts before it actually goes to sleep? (only since last driver / bios update)… but since I only did that for testing and never put it to sleep that way I don’t care. I don’t use hibernate (and I turned off fast boot) so I can’t give any advice on that.


I turned that off on Windows 10 as well.

When you say sleep are you talking about S0? IE: does it sleep, after 5% battery drain, it hibernates. If this is the case, how much time does it take before the threshold is reached? Is it about 2 hours, as is standard on Windows 10, provided you have shut down any audio sources?

I’ve enabled S3 on Windows 10, and while standby time is still bad, I can sleep for more than 2 hours at the detriment of battery life. Still that is more useful to me. If I know it is going to be more than 12 hours before I use it again, I’ll manually activate hibernation. (I think I’m going to set hibernation to automatically get triggered after 6 hours as a fail safe.)

I did a clean install of Windows 11 a few weeks ago and have had no significant issues with it. My only issues arise from some of the differences between W10 and W11eg I have had to change my start manager to enable me to use a couple of apps in the taskbar that otherwise don’t work under W11.

I frequently use hibernation and it works very well for me. I NEVER use sleep - too many problems as far as I am concerned with the computer waking itself up for unknown reasons and getting very hot because the lid remains closed. It was like that under W10. I tried briefly under W11 and it was just the same.

EDIT: The other issue I had with sleep was that, if I left it longer than I intended, it would turn off the computer and then I would lose my place. That doesn’t happen with hibernation.

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I’ve been running Windows 11 for about 1.5 weeks and haven’t had any issues. I upgraded via the Windows Update and not a fresh image. No issues yet, I have the recent option update that fixed a number of bugs, the most current Intel WiFi, Bluetooth, and graphics drivers.


Not until it has feature-parity with Windows 10. They mangled the taskbar especially.

At first, I was having issues with crashing but, now I love it!

A lot of the taskbar stuff, right-click menu, and click+drag stuff can be fixed with this program called StartAllBack.

Any touchpad gesture bound to forward/back navigation doesn’t work (yes, I know this is a Windows problem). I’ve sent feedback multiple times using the feedback app and nobody ever responded.
Also, the laptop doesn’t wake from an automatic sleep/hibernate (not sure which one). The power button’s LED has the breathing animation, but the laptop doesn’t respond and has to be force shut down by holding the button.
Other than that, and the usual “muh taskbar!” that everyone’s going on about, I’ve had no more problems.

I received access to it incredibly early so it improved overtime. As for your other message, haha, you’re right. However, I am so used to crashing as one of my RGB softwares… hates me

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“muh shareware!” :wink:

I honestly don’t see the point of updating when there are only regressions and issues, then spending money for third-party fixes on top of that. What benefit is there? The new scheduler doesn’t apply to TGL, what else…rounded corners?

For the average user? Not sure.

I know that from a gaming perspective Windows 11 brought some pretty compelling things to the table. Auto HDR, for example, is one thing.

As of now it’s … sort of a mixed bag of beans.
On one hand, Windows 11 is an absolute pain to set up, have measurably more overhead than Windows 10 and have massively less features/massively more bugs. For example, There are no setting that allow you to display everything inside that “notification area”, which is very annoying when you have multiple different widgets pop up at different times and you have to click the “overflow menu” and pick among them.

The other pain is that there is no way to set up the first user without an internet connection/microsoft account, thus the User folder will forever be the 5 letter of the E-mail you used (or your name), which is very annoying – to circumvent that you will have to create another user, give them admin rights, switch over, and delete the original setup account. Which will leave a bunch of registry dead ends and possible exploit.

Yet another one is BitLocker. Sometimes the encryption will “get stuck” at like 98% and neither attempt to encrypt nor allow you to decrypt, and the only current way I found that solve it is drive wipe and reinstall.
It added challenge to data recovery and only prevented the persons that stole your laptop from gaining access to the data. If you misplaced the decrypt/encrypt key and your device suddenly failed you are screwed.

But on the other hand, you might want to get fluent in using Windows 11 so you can “future proof” yourself?

So, unless I have a 12th gen machine, preferably touch screen, Windows 11 didn’t really bring that much to the table.

I tried out the beta after I first got the laptop when I was jumping around between a bunch of Linux distros and windows versions to see what I liked best at the time. Ended up back on Windows 10 since I couldn’t get a linux distro working nicely at the time (batch 2) and didn’t really have the time to configure linux. I didn’t go with 11 mostly because I’m weird and like having my taskbar on the top of the screen, which Microsoft has decided is unacceptable now. Looking to switching over to linux once I get the time to configure it, and the kernel is a little more compatible with the laptop (which it pretty much is a this point). Other than my taskbar woes, I did like Windows 11, and would have loved to upgrade to it.

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The goal of Linux (in my understanding) is to provide a barebone framework for people to use their computer. It is extremely customizable, very modular, and reasonably efficient. This meant that users can tailor their experience to a unparalleled extent.

However, the problem with that, is because it only provide a barebone structure/frame and absolutely no kind of reference, you have more than a dozen distro that are on a few different versions of the kernel (depend on their devs), different degrees of support for non-core features (hybid sleep, etc) and different degree of driver support. And because it is barebone, it don’t come with features like a (offline) package installer. You do have apt, but that’s command line. 80% of the users that use their computer have absolutely no idea what a command line even is, and even for people like me it’s not easy, cmd or shell alike.

Yes, I also tried Linux. I tried Ubuntu, and was … not very impressed when I need to open up the shell to install updates. Installing app is oddly un-straightforward, despite the fact that there exist tar.gz files.

Windows, for all the clutter it brought, have lots of built-in features and guis. Windows (R) Installer, for example. explorer.exe, for example. control.exe, for example. iExpress.exe from Win2K? sure.
Even the most basic (until windows 10) install have Winmine.exe for entertainment. And with Win10Pro, you have Hyper-V

While most of them require you to click “next” through multiple prompts of some sort “like some kind of monkey”, it’s a rather convenient … user-friendly, even, way of using computers.

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For me, Windows 11 is what is making me jump ship to Linux. The fact that they decided to change mostly surface layer stuff while it remains to be crappy old Windows under the hood irks me so. For instance, they haven’t finished migrating all of the settings, control panel still exists and is still required to adjust certain settings.

While my Framework runs Fedora, I’m still trying to work out a roadmap for switching all my other stuff. The hope is that the release of the Steam Deck provides a much needed boost in Linux Gaming support and that I can swap my Desktop over to Manjaro without too many problems.

In the meantime, Nothing about Windows 11 has excited me or even struck as a major improvement worth upgrading for. I’m going to use Windows 10 for as long as it’s in service.

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Screenshot from 2022-02-04 13-18-32

Not a single line of CLI there. In order - package manager, software “store”, update manager, offline package installer.

The best thing about Linux package management is it’s integrated into one, with automatic version checking, for every package, not just system packages. On Windows, you have to check programs you installed yourself manually, usually by going to the website. Some have built-in version checkers, but often those ones run a little (or large) program in the background.


I just got my Framework yesterday… first thing I did was install Windows 11.

I wiped it and installed Windows 10 by the end of the day.

Really annoyed by it. In particular, the things they took away needlessly. Yeah, we know Ctrl+Shift+Esc opens Task Manager, but at least 3 times I ended up right-clicking the taskbar to get it. Instead, glitchy ghosts of tooltips come up (saying “battery/volume” when I’m not hovering over that area, for example).

The performance slider (here: Windows 10) is just… gone.

The “open file location” for search results is just… gone. (for files in OneDrive) - here, Windows 10 for reference.

Emoji are an oversized, cartoonish joke (here, Windows 10 on the left, 11 on the right). Maybe I’m used to the expressions that Win10’s emoji panel provides, but at the same time, I didn’t need them to be literally 2x bigger and all look hopped-up on something. If they start animating I swear to god I’ma throw my computer out the window. :yum:
image image

All that, combined with the sandpaper-friction experience of the Framework’s god awful touchpad (I’m a touchpad user, and I am absolutely not enjoying this thing), and it was all I could take to not get instant buyer’s remorse… so I just went to Windows 10 and have felt a lot more comfortable. Maybe some day, Win11 will become tolerable. But that’s definitely not today.

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@Matt_Falcon Nice comparisons. Even from a single screenshot I can tell that Win 11 is half-baked:

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Don’t read too much into that :wink: I think it was partially scrolled. I had scrolled through it in awe at the terrible art and perplexed at “this is our future, isn’t it”. :tired_face: Probably didn’t hit the top before taking a screenshot. haha

Another screenshot from my Windows 11 “review”, lol:

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@Matt_Falcon Ah understood, I’ll go back to copeseething at this screenshot then :joy: