Matte screen: bad angles?

Framework Laptop 13
1

Hey guys,

I’ve been using a FW 13 Gen 1 with the glossy screen for some time now and ordered a second FW just this month as one of my family members will use my “old” device from now on. This time I went with the AMD version.

Honestly, I am somewhat unhappy with the matte screen. When I look at light/bright content and the lid is at a slight angle, I see some very thin, almost vertical greyish lines. It is hard to describe as there are no dead/faulty/not working pixels; the panel itself works perfectly. It rather seems that the matte finish is a little “rough” and reflects the light coming from the panel itself in a way that makes it uncomfortable to look at if the screen is not perfectly aligned to the viewing angle.

I regularly use matte screens and never noticed this kind of behavior before. I checked with my external monitor and an old thinkpad and didn’t find them to show these distracting lines.

Has anyone of you made a similar experience with the matte screens from framework or do you think I just got unlucky with my unit? I am hesitant to contact the support as I already had problems with the keyboard (and the replacement I just received yesterday is hardly any better) and I know that some quality loss is to be expected from matte screens… I will probably get used to it but I don’t find using the device as comfortable as using my old FW with the glossy screen.

Cheers
CHWD

2

Any chance you could share pictures? That sounds pretty funky, I’ve never heard of a problem like that before.

A support ticket would probably be the best way to get it resolved if it’s a defect.

3

I have no such thing, my screen is perfectly uniform regardless of the angle I look at, it looks just like any other good computer screen. Can you make a photo? I’d probably contact support.

Your problem sounds like the issues Framework has described for their factory-seconds models, which had minor screen issues like lines visible under certain angles. You screen probably should have been sorted there.

display with slight cosmetic issues: fine lines on the surface that are noticeable from certain angle and/or backlight non-uniformity visible from an angle on a white screen

1 Like
4

Thanks for your replies! I attempted to take pictures, but capturing the issue proved to be challenging.

While these photos primarily show artifacts, the screen somewhat resembles the circled area in the second picture (although with even thinner lines).

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IMG_20240131_194627_844_1
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5

As you say, your picture depicts moire artifacts from the camera. But even still, my matte screen doesn’t have anything like that when viewed at an angle. At least, nothing I’ve ever noticed. And I did use a glossy FW 13 before I got the AMD FW 13 with the matte display. So I had the comparison as well. As you say, the matte screen was…matte, lol, with a bit less contrast and punch than the glossy version. But no lines or artifacts that I’ve seen.

3 Likes
6

Yeah, same. Maybe get a different phone/camera to make better pictures of the problem. Or maybe move further away. I can’t see your screen getting replaced based on these photos. But if you really have lines, you should be able to get a replacement.

1 Like
7

Yeah, the photo obviously does not show the actual problem (and I doubt that I will be able to take a picture where the issue is not overshadowed by the Moire effect, no matter what camera I use) but to clarify how these lines look like to the eye.

As I won’t be able to prove that I can see these lines without a proper photo I am actually considering to buy a second screen full price. But I wanted to make sure that a (paid) replacement screen is not to be expected to show the very same lines that bother me. If you said that you had these lines too and that they should be considered normal, I would not fancy spending another 200 Euros or more on a second screen that behaves the same…

8

I just woke my laptop up and set the screen to various brightness levels and tilted the display every which way, trying to see any lines and I don’t see anything. Maybe it has to do with viewing distance? I was looking pretty close, trying to see any lines. Either way, my display is smooth and even.

1 Like
9

Hey chwd, welcome to the community.

I’m gonna be honest, I couldn’t fully understand the issue here from the description so I can’t say if this is just a ‘different expectations’ thing or there is something wrong with the screen you received. Do you think recording a video would show us what’s happening better?

1 Like
10

Hey Destroya,

Thanks a lot for the quick response. I’ve spent some time trying to capture the effect in a video, but unfortunately, I haven’t been successful. Let me try to describe the problem more precisely. I initially noticed the effect with bright backgrounds (websites, file manager, etc.), but I’ve just realized that it also occurs when displaying pure green (RGB: 0, 255, 0).

When I look directly at the display, everything is fine. If I glance slightly from the side, the color tone changes slightly, as expected, but I still see bright areas evenly illuminated. So far, so good!

However, when I look slightly from above at the display (for example, when tilting the laptop lid towards me), bright areas no longer appear uniformly illuminated. Instead, it seems like there is a kind of moire effect caused by the overlay of the matte glass and the underlying pixels. It looks like many light gray vertical lines are closely spaced, creating a sort of stripe pattern.

I’m aware that the effect in the photos is due to the camera’s resolution. My issue isn’t that these stripes appear when photographing the screen; it’s that I see a very similar pattern as soon as the screen is slightly tilted.

A similar problem seems to have occurred a few years ago, at least with ThinkPads: Lenovo Thinkpad T530 - LCD has strong moire effect - Super User

Cheers!

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11

Thank you for the detailed explanation! Please reach out to our support team so they can take a deeper look into it.

12

Hi @chwd. When submitting your ticket, please provide multiple images from multiple angles as from this image alone and what you’ve described, I am currently not of the belief that a replacement of the display would be warranted or would change the experience, but again, with additional example imagery of what you are describing, that could change.

Thank you.

1 Like
13

I just checked my screen again. If I look very close and really look for it, I can faintly see the vertical gray lines. I never would have noticed if I wasn’t really looking hard to see it and knew what to look for. So I can’t imagine mine is as bad as yours.

Hopefully you can get something figured out.

1 Like
14

Yeah, if you have the screen really close to your eyes, at some point you obviously start to see the lines between the pixels, or when having a solid green image, you’ll see the rows of green subpixels and the red and blue ones will be black.

That’s just how an LCD screen works and not a defect. The Framework has a pretty good dpi/resolution, and thus small pixels, but it’s not super high. Smartphones obviously have even smaller pixels.

15

That’s sounds like a Moire pattern from the slight unalignment of the pixels matrix of the LCD and of the geometrical regularities of the matte finish.

16

Hey everyone,

Thank you all for your numerous replies!

[quote="Jonathan_Haas, post:14, topic:44523]
Yeah, if you have the screen really close to your eyes, at some point you obviously start to see the lines between the pixels, or when having a solid green image, you’ll see the rows of green subpixels and the red and blue ones will be black.

That’s just how an LCD screen works and not a defect. The Framework has a pretty good dpi/resolution, and thus small pixels, but it’s not super high. Smartphones obviously have even smaller pixels.
[/quote]

I totally get that. However, my concern is a bit different. The resolution of the Framework is obviously high enough for me not to notice subpixels from a distance of 40 cm. But I can see artefacts on the matte screen that the glossy one does not show, so it is not about the resolution. As I mentioned, my display looks fine when viewed dead center. If I were complaining about subpixels, I wouldn’t have observed this effect on a white screen when all subpixels are turned on.

[quote="BigT, post:13, topic:44523]
I just checked my screen again. If I look very close and really look for it, I can faintly see the vertical gray lines. I never would have noticed if I wasn’t really looking hard to see it and knew what to look for. So I can’t imagine mine is as bad as yours.
[/quote]

It’s similar with my girlfriend’s laptop (not a FW); if you really focus, you might spot these lines, but they aren’t distracting in day-to-day use. On my unit, however, the distraction is significant enough that I find myself adjusting the lid angle frequently (I tend to move a few centimeters while working at my height-adjustable desk).

[quote="Destroya, post:11, topic:44523]
Thank you for the detailed explanation! Please reach out to our support team so they can take a deeper look into it.
[/quote]

[quote="TheTwistgibber, post:12, topic:44523]
Hi @chwd. When submitting your ticket, please provide multiple images from multiple angles as from this image alone and what you’ve described, I am currently not of the belief that a replacement of the display would be warranted or would change the experience, but again, with additional example imagery of what you are describing, that could change.

Thank you.
[/quote]

I don’t think I’ll submit a ticket as I won’t be able to provide convincing images.

[quote="Mapleleaf, post:15, topic:44523]
That’s sounds like a Moire pattern from the slight unalignment of the pixels matrix of the LCD and of the geometrical regularities of the matte finish.
[/quote]

I do not know whether you are right, but that is at least the most accurate way I could descripe my viewing experience. @TheTwistgibber @Destroya Are you aware that this might be a thing with the matte screens? Has this been reported before?

I plan to visit a friend in two weeks who also owns a Framework with the matte screen. I’ll compare his screen to mine, and if his screen is more comfortable to use, I might consider ordering a replacement. If he doesn’t see the lines on my unit, we could even swap the displays thanks to the modularity. And if I find his screen similarly distracting and it turns out to be a ‘different expectations’ thing, I could still go back to the glossy option. In any case, I’ll post an update. :slight_smile:

2 Likes
18

I see something like you are describing. It is really faint and only visible on a very specific angle. Needed to really look for it. A lot less distracting at its worst than even the specs of dust on my display. The lines are not perfectly vertical but slightly tilted so nothing to do with the pixel grid. I suspect some kind of normal manufacturing process causing this, but maybe your case is worse or out of spec.
LCD displays can have many imperfections (backlight bleed, IPS glow, low contrast, viewing angles) but the matte 13 is one of the better ones I have used.

19

Hey @anon81945988 ,

the lines I see are spaced more like 1mm apart. I don’t wear spectacles/glasses and the effect is visible without any electronic devices nearby.

I use Fedora and already tried every setting considering scaling/antialiasing I could find as that was my first guess as well. Unfortunately the lines are also visible in the UEFI, so it does not look like it has anything to do with these kind of things.

Cheers!

1 Like
20

The framework panel definitely is one of the better ones and I haven’t had any problems with IPS glow, backlight bleed and so on. I hope you are not bothered by the lines now you saw them once. :smiley:

22

No, thankfully my display is always dusty enough :joy: But in all seriousness, I can see them only if I really look for them in that specific angle. At that level of inspection absolutely all of my many displays are not perfect in one way or another and none I have owned (or seen) ever were.